0:0:0.0 --> 0:0:9.80
Maffei, Clare J
Umm, I don't have any announcements today. Do you? We're gonna do with
therapist and just wrap up general questions about Mega Kayla Day.
0:0:14.380 --> 0:0:14.790
Maffei, Clare J
OK.
0:0:9.760 --> 0:0:17.590
Droege, Sam
I think we're gonna probably spend the whole time on leathergoods lethargy,
opsis kinds of thing. There's actually more than meets the eye.
0:0:18.780 --> 0:0:19.760
Droege, Sam
So should we go?
0:0:20.660 --> 0:0:21.550
Droege, Sam
Clear. OK.
0:0:20.500 --> 0:0:21.820
Maffei, Clare J
Yeah. Take it away.
0:0:22.710 --> 0:0:52.110
Droege, Sam
All right. So maybe I'll, I'll just introduce the the the problem and we're
gonna bring in not just with their opsis, which are the native group formerly
conjoined with leathergoods and called lethargica. So you'll see old literature
on that. And then the someone I can't remember who split out the what amounts
to the European species or the old world species from the new world species
and.
0:0:52.900 --> 0:0:57.590
Droege, Sam
Mike, do you know, are all the new world species cactus specialists?
0:0:58.80 --> 0:0:59.540
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Our as we know, yeah.
0:0:59.520 --> 0:0:59.890
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:1:4.220 --> 0:1:4.500
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:1:0.220 --> 0:1:7.180
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And and not just to punch you, but they go to, you know, figure out cactus and
some other things. But but in the east, I think it's just fun to you.
0:1:7.680 --> 0:1:37.610
Droege, Sam
Yeah. And people were saying that already in Florida, they've gotten gibbosa.
So, but back to this thing and we'll just cover lethargic criteria because
people should be chrysorrheus because people should be aware of it. So the
short story introduced species first noted in Phillipsburg, NJ, 70 in the 70s,
documented as having destroyed an entire house. Basically all the siding and
the porch. It's a excavator.
0:1:37.880 --> 0:1:44.50
Droege, Sam
Of wood, which the native ones are not. Although do they excavate into cacti by
any chance?
0:1:44.410 --> 0:1:50.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I have seen their ohh one in a agatti stem.
0:1:51.660 --> 0:1:52.140
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:1:52.590 --> 0:1:53.440
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But I don't know if this.
0:1:52.990 --> 0:1:55.130
Droege, Sam
Did it make it? Did it make that hole?
0:1:54.180 --> 0:1:56.130
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That's what I don't. That's what I don't know.
0:1:56.330 --> 0:1:56.700
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:1:57.90 --> 0:1:59.980
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I'm sure there's some we probably just out from remembering the literature.
0:2:1.140 --> 0:2:30.130
Droege, Sam
So one of the European species has made it over the, as I mentioned, so that's
the Phillipsburg one. And we'll chew into softwood. Apparently. It goes into
the the summer wood and avoids the winter woods. So it's not perhaps as robust
as a Carpenter bee. People have subsequently found it drilling holes in
Pennsylvania and New Jersey, which are the only two states that as far as I
know, we have records for now.
0:2:31.560 --> 0:2:35.350
Droege, Sam
Quite enough that they're showing up on I naturalist.
0:2:36.240 --> 0:3:0.50
Droege, Sam
And they'll they'll go into firewood. So a firewood is a good place to look for
this species. And because they're going into things like firewood, that means
they could jump anywhere in the country and we'll show a couple pictures. And
the another interesting thing is, and another reason to collect on Sentara. So
the what's the common name for that?
0:3:1.20 --> 0:3:1.270
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:3:2.40 --> 0:3:2.690
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:2:59.370 --> 0:3:3.320
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Spotted in half weed knapweed spotted next week, at least in the in the east.
0:3:3.810 --> 0:3:34.860
Droege, Sam
Yeah. So the nap, right, and who knows what they're gonna do with starthistle
and all that craziness out West anyway, they could be easily jumping from state
to state on firewood. And they also nest in historic structures, covered
bridges, other kinds of things. I think we'll hear more about this and what's
going on now is we're kind of waiting for them to expand the right on the
Maryland border. Still no records from Maryland right on the New York border.
No records for New York.
0:3:34.960 --> 0:3:35.900
Droege, Sam
And I'm aware of.
0:3:36.600 --> 0:4:5.600
Droege, Sam
And and it's a, it is a nap. We'd specialist, which is in in. There are several
interesting introduced bees like make a Kylie apicalis and others that I'm
forgetting that whole little rotund data apicalis concinna or Priscilla Group,
along with its celiac's coturnix seem to love little clumps of knapweed.
0:4:10.50 --> 0:4:10.230
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well.
0:4:6.340 --> 0:4:15.200
Droege, Sam
Along railroad tracks, that's where I usually might go to go to a railroad and
collect, and in a city and you'll find some interesting things.
0:4:15.840 --> 0:4:18.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yet we found sculpture Alice too, in that way.
0:4:19.40 --> 0:4:19.390
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:4:20.40 --> 0:4:23.390
Droege, Sam
Yep, and so.
0:4:22.770 --> 0:4:23.730
Maffei, Clare J
So Elliot.
0:4:31.690 --> 0:4:32.0
Droege, Sam
Uh-huh.
0:4:24.600 --> 0:4:39.270
Maffei, Clare J
Elliot shares with her. God's nests are found in Yucca and agave and Soto
sotalol stems in the southwest deserts, which I think they may bore themselves,
but maybe they could use reuse xylocopa tunnels.
0:4:40.520 --> 0:4:40.890
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:4:40.620 --> 0:4:40.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:4:42.270 --> 0:4:56.60
Droege, Sam
Alright, I'm gonna try to share here and we'll just talk for a second on
splitting out with Argus and Litharge Opsis since at least pretty soon, you may
have to, although the using really different habitats.
0:4:57.80 --> 0:5:4.250
Droege, Sam
We've got here on deck, some pictures. Well, here's the guide. The B General
guide.
0:5:5.110 --> 0:5:11.580
Droege, Sam
And Mike, you don't really cover this because it's not a Midwest species,
right? Have you got some lethargy, lethargy, opsis.
0:5:16.560 --> 0:5:16.890
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:5:11.680 --> 0:5:20.170
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Yeah, it's at the very top of the key of my life. Rogosky it just there's
in it. It compares the two genera.
0:5:20.580 --> 0:5:20.950
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:5:22.380 --> 0:5:27.820
Droege, Sam
And it's probably pretty similar because I think I extracted this from the.
0:5:29.20 --> 0:5:44.620
Droege, Sam
The revision that split the two out, and so I'll let you talk. And I'm gonna
get on deck a species about what? The lithographs and lethargy us in terms of
how you're covering it in your guide, which people got today.
0:5:46.620 --> 0:5:47.90
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:5:58.950 --> 0:5:59.600
Mike Slater
You want that?
0:5:55.340 --> 0:6:1.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Other than the host plant difference would say I'm just mentioned which is
major.
0:6:5.270 --> 0:6:5.830
Maffei, Clare J
I got it.
0:6:1.40 --> 0:6:7.610
Mike Slater
One that the light on in there. I'm gonna turn it off. I was trying to get on
that computer and I could. No, I have.
0:6:9.370 --> 0:6:9.560
Mike Slater
I.
0:6:12.430 --> 0:6:13.640
Droege, Sam
All right. I think we're good.
0:6:18.310 --> 0:6:22.310
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK. Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead, Sir.
0:6:19.70 --> 0:6:37.640
Droege, Sam
OK, Mike, I'm just keeping up here. I just got a a mandible shot here. They
just to show what sort of is the group difference from other species and we'll
see a couple other things like their the mails rear end is really different,
but.
0:6:38.850 --> 0:6:44.350
Droege, Sam
Here's this what you'll see in the Discover Life Key, and I think Mike,
probably your genus key too.
0:6:45.490 --> 0:6:50.420
Droege, Sam
Which is that there's three. I'm gonna add a little light here, but there's
three.
0:6:51.780 --> 0:6:58.520
Droege, Sam
Tips are prawns all about at the same plane. All the center one is proud of it.
0:6:59.780 --> 0:7:8.60
Droege, Sam
That at the tip of the mandibles mean add a little more light, although that's
that's reasonably good. I think people can see that.
0:7:6.790 --> 0:7:9.90
Maffei, Clare J
Did you just say the center one is proud?
0:7:9.770 --> 0:7:10.120
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:7:9.740 --> 0:7:10.630
Maffei, Clare J
Like it's bigger.
0:7:11.340 --> 0:7:34.690
Droege, Sam
Well, it's if you go from the side, you'll see that the center one is elevated
compared to these two. And I'm looking at a A bleak angle here. But if I this
is the problem. So this is a mail chrysalis, but the the native lethargy opsis
also do this. If I turn this and I look straight on these two side prongs are.
0:7:35.570 --> 0:7:47.260
Droege, Sam
And this is the same thing with uh anthophora terminalis just like, is there
anything there? They become hard to see. So it's it's sometimes gets
overlooked, I think.
0:7:49.180 --> 0:7:50.780
Droege, Sam
Any comments on that, Mike?
0:7:50.980 --> 0:7:54.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Well, yeah, the mandibles.
0:7:54.700 --> 0:8:6.150
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, look different at different angles, I guess until you get used to it, but
also the male males of criterias and that whole genus don't have a rolia.
0:8:7.150 --> 0:8:7.530
Droege, Sam
Right.
0:8:7.590 --> 0:8:9.160
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And our native ones do.
0:8:10.980 --> 0:8:11.480
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So.
0:8:12.530 --> 0:8:13.210
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That's helpful.
0:8:14.270 --> 0:8:16.770
Droege, Sam
Is it or is it the? Or is it the opposite?
0:8:20.210 --> 0:8:20.600
Droege, Sam
Maybe.
0:8:17.950 --> 0:8:22.10
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, no, I'll, I'll. I'll indeed. Ones males have orolia.
0:8:22.550 --> 0:8:23.0
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:8:23.750 --> 0:8:27.150
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I made mistakes before I think.
0:8:25.350 --> 0:8:27.310
Droege, Sam
Maybe I, maybe I may.
0:8:30.910 --> 0:8:31.570
Mike Arduser (Guest)
We'll double check.
0:8:39.380 --> 0:8:40.60
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Right, right.
0:8:30.230 --> 0:8:53.120
Droege, Sam
OK. Ohh yeah right, males and liturgies males. I'm looking at the DL guide
males in Leatherby's have no rolia, right. And so in lithopolis. Sorry that was
my mixing up to things. Have a really eye and that also would split them from
Mega Kylie which has and both males and females have no orolia.
0:8:54.530 --> 0:9:6.880
Droege, Sam
But then in the females make you wanna mention female leathergoods lithographs
from Mega Kylie characters, you know, play around with this a little bit.
0:9:6.40 --> 0:9:16.190
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, they they do, you know, in the field, if you're not familiar with them,
you might misinterpret alike. Third Gus or life. Argosy said female mega Kylie.
0:9:17.80 --> 0:9:26.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But when you look at him closely, they're quite different. The mandibles are
different and and as as we'll see in a little bit, the faces are entirely
different.
0:9:27.530 --> 0:9:46.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But uh, female life for DOCSIS have a little tiny pygidial plate. It's big in
the males, but in the females it it's more like a spine and it's really easy to
overlook, but it's still is very different than the tail end of Omega Kylie.
0:9:48.830 --> 0:10:6.0
Droege, Sam
OK, I finally remembered how to set this up. So we have these three and this is
a male on the criterias and you'll see similar to the native ones, which is why
they were placed there. This weird pygidial plate that.
0:10:6.900 --> 0:10:7.840
Droege, Sam
Is.
0:10:8.950 --> 0:10:17.690
Droege, Sam
I guess you could see this sort of thing a little bit in some of the southern
mega, Kylie.
0:10:18.690 --> 0:10:22.940
Droege, Sam
Which have a UM instead of the usual.
0:10:23.680 --> 0:10:25.660
Droege, Sam
He marginated I guess I would call it.
0:10:26.340 --> 0:10:29.70
Droege, Sam
Umm plate at the end.
0:10:30.280 --> 0:10:36.410
Droege, Sam
And actually have a plate that is secondary to the rim of T6.
0:10:37.570 --> 0:10:39.760
Droege, Sam
Trying to do 2 things at once, which is we're.
0:10:40.560 --> 0:10:41.230
Droege, Sam
Performed.
0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:50.840
Droege, Sam
These don't have this and then this is a mail. So this is what Mike was talking
about in terms of more of a prominent.
0:10:53.180 --> 0:10:53.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That's good shot.
0:10:51.660 --> 0:10:58.490
Droege, Sam
And to it, so that little spike like thing there, the pygidial plate. I'm not
sure why the male has it.
0:11:0.740 --> 0:11:10.470
Droege, Sam
Theoretically, in the female it's useful for padding down the edges of a a nest
of whatever's gonna be in it or moving, I guess product around.
0:11:11.260 --> 0:11:14.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And our native life, they're cops. Is males also have that.
0:11:15.80 --> 0:11:15.250
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:11:16.110 --> 0:11:17.90
Mike Arduser (Guest)
This looks just like that.
0:11:18.40 --> 0:11:33.320
Droege, Sam
So Chryslers has this vibe, a bit of being relatively ocre or a a strong,
sometimes downright orangish cast to it in a flip now to some pictures.
0:11:34.30 --> 0:11:58.60
Droege, Sam
Here I that is a native. This is maybe a little oranger, perhaps because of the
coloration, but you'll see on some specimens that they have a very noticeable
orangy yellow strong. This is maybe a little stronger than normal, but it's
pretty noticeable rear end that's just bright orange.
0:11:58.990 --> 0:12:28.680
Droege, Sam
That can help and you can't see it very well in this picture, but we'll see
some shots that the face in both these groups and this is again the face. So
here's a Ridge. We're looking at it straight on. So it's not as dramatic as one
would see if you're playing around with the microscope, which we can do, we'll
see in all the females of that group. This Ridge is extremely prominent. I
assume it's for moving mud.
0:12:28.800 --> 0:12:34.0
Droege, Sam
Or some other type of thing, but do you know Mike, what the purpose for that
is?
0:12:38.250 --> 0:12:38.580
Droege, Sam
Hmm.
0:12:40.450 --> 0:12:40.750
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:12:32.980 --> 0:12:46.280
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I you know, I've never seen any soil particles or anything attached to that,
and I've I've looked at a lot of them and the shape is different too, between
different species. So I wondered the same thing. I just wondered what?
0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:48.140
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:12:47.240 --> 0:12:48.190
Mike Arduser (Guest)
What's the deal there?
0:12:50.930 --> 0:12:51.660
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ohh totally.
0:12:49.300 --> 0:13:4.910
Droege, Sam
And the shape is useful so you'll see and, and Mike's guide and in the Discover
Life Guide, which includes all the Western species, although probably needed to
be reviewed to see if we're as up to date on some of these eastern
distributions as before, there's that but again.
0:13:5.150 --> 0:13:8.270
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I wanna say one thing about that saying that one of our natives.
0:13:11.510 --> 0:13:11.770
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:13:10.260 --> 0:13:16.640
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Capitalis, which occurred occurs as Far East as Kansas and Oklahoma has the
same kind of a red bud.
0:13:18.110 --> 0:13:18.930
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Looks just like that.
0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:39.740
Droege, Sam
Ohh OK. In fact I I I have some apicalis so I'll pull that out. There's there's
also I think we'll move. We can come back to Chrysler is there's some
differences. In fact, here's a good example of a difference. I'm not sure what
your keys shows, but when we're looking at ohh, this is, is this a male or
female?
0:13:42.350 --> 0:13:42.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
E-mail.
0:13:49.70 --> 0:13:49.330
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:53.210
Droege, Sam
And this should be a female. Yeah, there's differences in the ratio of F1 to
the next segment and.
0:13:54.370 --> 0:14:6.870
Droege, Sam
For some reason is that F1 there or is that the pedestal and the F1 is supposed
to be quite a bit longer than F2? I think maybe it's the angle we're looking at
here.
0:14:8.160 --> 0:14:10.920
Droege, Sam
I thought right or is it? Do I have that reversed?
0:14:12.410 --> 0:14:13.340
Droege, Sam
Ohh like in?
0:14:12.50 --> 0:14:14.820
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, in in Christ, serious.
0:14:17.340 --> 0:14:17.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The.
0:14:17.830 --> 0:14:20.980
Maffei, Clare J
It looks to me like if one is longer that you're a little.
0:14:21.380 --> 0:14:23.70
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It should be it, yeah.
0:14:22.770 --> 0:14:24.980
Droege, Sam
Yeah. At the same time, there is the.
0:14:22.660 --> 0:14:25.190
Maffei, Clare J
Yeah, the symbol that you have there is the pedestal.
0:14:26.480 --> 0:14:55.40
Droege, Sam
That's the pedestal. It's just like the pedestal I'm used to seeing. I don't
pay much attention to the pedestals, but that seems very long for pedestals. So
anyway, F1 is a lot, so if you everyone agrees that that is actually what the
marker is on is F1, which I gonna guess it is, then it is very clearly longer
by quite a bit than F2 when we look at our native species, it's going to be
about the same size.
0:14:55.480 --> 0:14:57.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And that's true for both sexes too.
0:14:57.990 --> 0:15:9.800
Droege, Sam
Yeah. So, OK, I'll put this picture to rest. Ohh I have gibbosa gibbosa shot
here I believe. And here's.
0:15:9.920 --> 0:15:14.800
Droege, Sam
Ah, the antennae. I guess they do have long pedestals, but.
0:15:17.70 --> 0:15:40.210
Droege, Sam
It's a little bit dark in this shot, but that's the pedestal. There's F1 and I
think this is F2 and there's a line that looks like a segment, but I think
that's a hair. So F1 maybe a little bit, but nowhere near twice as long as it
was in the other. So that's agent I a character that can be used as separate
out the two. If there's any question.
0:15:42.190 --> 0:15:50.600
Droege, Sam
And in terms of if you see something that looks like a litharge opsis,
particularly, you should be aware of it of things showing up in an urban
environment.
0:15:53.610 --> 0:15:55.460
Droege, Sam
So this is the need and this is a gibbosa.
0:15:56.150 --> 0:16:3.190
Droege, Sam
And a southern species. And you wait. I think I have a shot of the.
0:16:4.380 --> 0:16:15.110
Droege, Sam
Umm little bit difficult to see the head plate there on that one, but you can
see the end is brown. It also has that tip on it.
0:16:18.90 --> 0:16:20.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And that occurs in southern Missouri too, by the way.
0:16:20.210 --> 0:16:21.580
Droege, Sam
How? It's a mail, that's why.
0:16:23.430 --> 0:16:32.20
Droege, Sam
Let's look at distributions for a second. And Mike, you can fill us in on some
interesting things that have been going on in the Midwest in terms of what you've
been seeing.
0:16:32.640 --> 0:16:45.600
Droege, Sam
Ah, showing up. So here's just what we have from discover life. So what you're
looking at different colors or different species, and this includes state
centroids from John Asher, which is.
0:16:46.740 --> 0:17:16.350
Droege, Sam
Not representative of an actual specimen. Just says somewhere in state X we
know that a species occurs and it includes includes actual data. I can get rid
of John's information, but sometimes it's the only thing available. Here's that
Lutherhaus Chrysler is, as we currently know, that introduced species expected
to spread in squares, and this is gibbosa. And then what? Apicalis blue. And
then?
0:17:17.610 --> 0:17:18.910
Droege, Sam
Like take it from there. Take it away.
0:17:18.840 --> 0:17:21.810
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Look, the dark blue is littoralis.
0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:22.510
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:17:22.940 --> 0:17:28.450
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Which used to have used to be called Russia a long time ago, and it's been some
of the literature you still see that.
0:17:29.30 --> 0:17:30.510
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm but.
0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:49.10
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I just somebody I work with and and think highly of Laura Ririka just emailed
me yesterday that she had found the specimen collected in 1981 by John Bausman
at the Illinois Natural History Survey was collected in.
0:17:50.210 --> 0:17:53.110
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Up in central Illinois, which is.
0:17:54.510 --> 0:17:59.50
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That's totally new now. That's an it's a, you know, 40 year old specimen, but.
0:18:2.870 --> 0:18:3.350
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:18:4.490 --> 0:18:5.210
Droege, Sam
So that.
0:17:59.520 --> 0:18:8.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm, you know, it was there it is. And and then and then further even to the
West there's another site.
0:18:8.990 --> 0:18:10.530
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm where?
0:18:11.670 --> 0:18:33.120
Mike Arduser (Guest)
She's she found this this undescribed what we think is an undescribed species
that we formally thought was restricted to the Ozarks. Into my key. I just call
it those Arkansas. And it's very similar to literalize, but mails are quite
different. And it's also in Illinois. So we.
0:18:33.830 --> 0:18:42.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
If we tend to think of these things as more Western or southern, but there's
some of them are getting into the Midwest or maybe have been here all along
this in relic sites, I don't know.
0:18:45.940 --> 0:18:47.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep, Yep.
0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:48.140
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep.
0:18:51.780 --> 0:18:52.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:18:43.120 --> 0:18:53.450
Droege, Sam
So are they showing up in like a puncha locations in pretty high high quality
sites? Or how would you characterize it? So people should be looking in
prairies?
0:19:5.890 --> 0:19:6.210
Droege, Sam
Uh-huh.
0:19:20.20 --> 0:19:20.420
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:18:54.10 --> 0:19:22.780
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I would say, uh, fairly high quality sites, you know, at least in the
Ozarks and parts of Missouri, cactus can be kind of weaving aggressive and
pastures because nobody eats it. But we've never found any. I forgot opsis in
those kind of sites. They're always in rocky glades or that kind of or sandy
sights not in weedy disturbed sites.
0:19:23.960 --> 0:19:41.80
Droege, Sam
So recently the Opuntia of the Southeast, which I'm not sure how that impacts
you as been split into six different species. I would. Do you think there is a
possible a bunch of species driver to some of that distributional change?
0:19:42.20 --> 0:19:42.790
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I don't know.
0:19:47.320 --> 0:19:48.90
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Don't know Sam.
0:19:48.290 --> 0:19:49.100
Droege, Sam
Something to look at.
0:19:58.260 --> 0:19:58.670
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:20:3.820 --> 0:20:4.110
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:20:4.860 --> 0:20:5.900
Droege, Sam
Not the same time of year.
0:19:49.510 --> 0:20:7.630
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The ones the species that are on the upper Midwest in the
USA. And I forget the other one, maybe those have been split, but it's super to
us, they all they look the same. The flowers are big and yellow and they
doesn't look. Yes, exactly. So I would.
0:20:8.730 --> 0:20:14.220
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I don't know that any of them are specialists on a certain species of Opuntia,
or a group of species they.
0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:14.640
Droege, Sam
Right.
0:20:25.810 --> 0:20:26.30
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep.
0:20:15.500 --> 0:20:26.850
Droege, Sam
So also this whole central area where there's a general absence of records of
could indeed have pockets of lithographs hanging around.
0:20:27.940 --> 0:20:28.770
Droege, Sam
Alright so.
0:20:32.70 --> 0:20:32.420
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:20:27.210 --> 0:20:34.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Yeah, they're very, very common in the Ozarks. We got a lot of lot of
records and there didn't used to be any, but nobody knew it was there.
0:20:35.680 --> 0:20:36.690
Droege, Sam
Yeah, cool.
0:20:39.420 --> 0:20:40.940
Droege, Sam
And is that uh?
0:20:35.940 --> 0:20:42.510
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And now it's that's widely distributed across the Ozarks in certain, in certain
places, you know.
0:20:45.610 --> 0:20:45.950
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:20:42.960 --> 0:20:52.280
Droege, Sam
So here's gibbosa that's probably Missouri, but is so what's the relationship
of gibbosa to the new species? The Ozark ansis thing?
0:20:52.530 --> 0:20:54.750
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Very different in appearance. I mean, you wouldn't confuse him.
0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:55.780
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:20:55.730 --> 0:20:59.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The the the female face is the shape of the Super click girl.
0:21:0.770 --> 0:21:1.330
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh.
0:21:2.80 --> 0:21:3.310
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Thing is very different.
0:21:3.730 --> 0:21:4.0
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:21:15.500 --> 0:21:15.790
Droege, Sam
Uh-huh.
0:21:5.70 --> 0:21:19.260
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And they're in flight at the same time, but we haven't. We haven't found him in
the same places. The the Bosa records in this area are in sandy, sandy areas.
And the all the Ozark anxious ones.
0:21:20.590 --> 0:21:23.590
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Are in rocky, rough, rugged.
0:21:27.330 --> 0:21:27.600
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:21:24.570 --> 0:21:29.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, what we call Ozarks, what we call Glades, where there's no sand. So.
0:21:29.430 --> 0:21:29.770
Droege, Sam
Great.
0:21:36.740 --> 0:21:36.980
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep.
0:21:30.950 --> 0:21:42.830
Droege, Sam
Well, that kind of glade rocky habitat, I mean that extends into well into
Tennessee and different places and Arkansas. And so, yeah, you're right.
There's there's there's places to look.
0:21:43.270 --> 0:21:50.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. If you see Cactus I camp out, you know, and and work it because I mean,
there are also other.
0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:55.10
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:21:50.680 --> 0:21:55.970
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Generally, speeds visit as well, and it's a it's an important plant to work.
0:21:59.50 --> 0:21:59.840
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep, Yep.
0:22:0.0 --> 0:22:1.550
Droege, Sam
For some reason, I'm not sure why.
0:22:2.450 --> 0:22:8.760
Droege, Sam
OK, so things things to do for everyone there. Yeah, you can see this is a sand
echo there.
0:22:9.230 --> 0:22:9.860
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:22:11.10 --> 0:22:24.530
Droege, Sam
OK, so let's go. I think we'll go to. So I'll just mention that discover life,
I think Michael Orr has did all the all the species.
0:22:28.140 --> 0:22:28.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ohh.
0:22:29.300 --> 0:22:29.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:22:25.700 --> 0:22:29.910
Droege, Sam
And then I think we updated this new species as Arkansas, I think.
0:22:30.710 --> 0:22:31.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Francis.
0:22:31.70 --> 0:22:50.560
Droege, Sam
Francis has added in those we'll do a quick check, so this should reflect both
what Michael Orr has done and you have done and it should be a pretty complete
thing. So we yeah, modified from Mike Gardiner Key whoever that guy is, so.
0:22:51.800 --> 0:23:22.0
Droege, Sam
We so this should be pretty good, although I think we probably should take a
look at some point because of the distributional things you said and look at
what states are listed for each. But be that as it may, it's easier in general
and lots of people are familiar with and like dichotomous keys. So maybe we'll
just go through your key now for the rest of the time period and look at the
Midwestern species.
0:23:22.80 --> 0:23:30.740
Droege, Sam
You know, people are interested in the Western ones, which I really don't have
experience with. They have the discover life key and of course keys from the
literature.
0:23:31.660 --> 0:23:32.410
Droege, Sam
And any.
0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:36.690
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But but like these, like you said, I mean there are you know, sites in
Tennessee.
0:23:40.430 --> 0:23:40.850
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:23:38.90 --> 0:23:44.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You know, outside of Nashville, these Glady flat, I mean those, those would
bear some looking into.
0:23:44.840 --> 0:23:45.280
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:23:45.910 --> 0:23:48.770
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And yeah, so still.
0:23:50.20 --> 0:23:53.150
Mike Arduser (Guest)
They're they. Some of these things may be further E than we realize.
0:23:55.360 --> 0:23:55.720
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:23:57.460 --> 0:23:58.490
Droege, Sam
All right, so.
0:24:7.310 --> 0:24:7.840
Mike Arduser (Guest)
All good.
0:23:59.820 --> 0:24:11.670
Droege, Sam
Let's just make you wanna just take us through here and I've got some
specimens. For example, I've got a female gibbosa which I'll I'll put on deck
here and we'll get a look at the.
0:24:13.50 --> 0:24:18.900
Droege, Sam
It's a female. I don't have a male and we can look at the face as you talk
about these kinds of things.
0:24:18.680 --> 0:24:23.630
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, the the Super super clinical area on all these species.
0:24:24.770 --> 0:24:28.570
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Is produced unlike any other.
0:24:29.880 --> 0:24:43.470
Mike Arduser (Guest)
BI can think of and it's. It's not just produced a little, it's dramatically
raised and it's shape varies. Sometimes it's more squarish, sometimes it's kind
of like almost horn like.
0:24:45.210 --> 0:24:55.690
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So it's really really useful and it doesn't wear, you know, it doesn't wear
down. I mean, it's always there and it's super useful even with a hand lens or
maybe with the naked eyes on it, you could see it.
0:24:57.150 --> 0:25:17.630
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And then below that Super Clipper, you'll area. I mean, as you can see here,
the Clippers itself is flattened. And so the entire face of our native species
is very unlike anything else we've got in the east. And pretty interesting also
the mouth, the tongue, the mouth parts are even for a mega kaylin are long,
super long.
0:25:18.400 --> 0:25:19.80
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And.
0:25:20.530 --> 0:25:23.70
Mike Arduser (Guest)
They are never fold it. I mean they're always exposed.
0:25:23.750 --> 0:25:29.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ohh, I'd that that's a key character, but it certainly is notable.
0:25:31.250 --> 0:25:35.810
Droege, Sam
Trying to get one of these shots I have of ohh I'm in Chrysalis.
0:25:38.290 --> 0:25:41.990
Droege, Sam
One of these has shows the length of the tongue there.
0:25:42.290 --> 0:25:43.560
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Oh yeah, yeah.
0:25:48.200 --> 0:25:49.660
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Right, right. Similarly.
0:25:50.550 --> 0:25:50.870
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:25:44.70 --> 0:26:2.620
Droege, Sam
The only other I mean there is Megan Kylie Ena theory, which has a even longer
tongue which but it's it's a an interestingly it does have only three teeth but
there are aligned along a sort of a normal side.
0:26:5.360 --> 0:26:5.750
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:26:4.500 --> 0:26:9.630
Droege, Sam
Presentation that maybe kylies have, but yeah, that's interesting.
0:26:22.810 --> 0:26:23.570
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Oh, OK.
0:26:13.130 --> 0:26:33.660
Droege, Sam
Alright, so we can see here if we to see what Mike has and I have apicalis
females too to show, but but then that's it. So if we go to, I guess so many
things open here. If we go to the.
0:26:43.650 --> 0:26:43.880
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:26:35.680 --> 0:26:44.330
Droege, Sam
Litharge opsis key. You'll see some of these things are listed out here in
terms of the different shapes that are helpful.
0:26:44.870 --> 0:26:54.480
Droege, Sam
Umm. And you know long term it'd be nice to get some pictures of some of these
things placed in here, but if we're looking at Mike's key here.
0:26:55.0 --> 0:26:59.750
Droege, Sam
Umm, so what's what are the keys for gibbosa?
0:27:0.760 --> 0:27:1.230
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:27:3.10 --> 0:27:12.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
There there isn't any malice space. First of all, and there's no pit. And as
we'll see in the others, that is something that's always present.
0:27:13.920 --> 0:27:24.350
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And also the Super Clipsal Eric thing, that's the the produced part of the
Super clip is is it's not concave, it's not horn like it's more.
0:27:25.570 --> 0:27:28.310
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I described it as sub rectangular semicircular.
0:27:29.430 --> 0:27:35.160
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And that may not mean anything until you see the others, but the others are a
very different shape.
0:27:36.160 --> 0:27:57.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Then, like Sam said with, with Christ serious mandibles, it sometimes depends
on viewing angle. And so when you're looking at these things, look at from
multiple angles and and to decide if whether something's concave or produce
laterally or that sort of thing. But the ghost Gebos is pretty distinct.
0:27:58.690 --> 0:28:0.180
Droege, Sam
OK, I'm changing the.
0:27:58.960 --> 0:28:2.160
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And and it's big. It's big too, relatively speaking.
0:28:2.750 --> 0:28:5.980
Droege, Sam
I'm changing the view here so we can look at it from.
0:28:7.590 --> 0:28:12.580
Droege, Sam
The side I mean I only have one specimen, but the.
0:28:14.330 --> 0:28:19.330
Droege, Sam
Uh, the apicalis specimens I have are even bigger in terms of species.
0:28:23.60 --> 0:28:23.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well, that's looking good.
0:28:20.690 --> 0:28:24.60
Droege, Sam
Level things, then, are the gibbosa.
0:28:25.900 --> 0:28:26.450
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Good.
0:28:35.950 --> 0:28:36.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No, that's a good shot.
0:28:27.680 --> 0:28:37.380
Droege, Sam
Yeah, these things can be stick way out. Like you would not miss that. If you
look straight on like we did before, it doesn't look as nearly as dramatic, but
that's pretty dramatic.
0:28:38.10 --> 0:28:45.650
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Yeah. So you see, there's no the the Mailer spaces linear. At best,
there's no big pit there.
0:28:46.910 --> 0:28:56.220
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The way it is in some of the others. So you like that. You notice that's kind
of in a general way that's kind of squarish and none of the others look like
that. That's pretty unique to give.
0:28:58.210 --> 0:28:59.410
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The females.
0:28:57.900 --> 0:29:0.590
Droege, Sam
We should also mention, sorry, go ahead.
0:29:0.890 --> 0:29:2.920
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, females and males have nothing like that.
0:29:2.200 --> 0:29:4.900
Droege, Sam
Yeah, mail of meals are.
0:29:11.570 --> 0:29:11.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:29:6.400 --> 0:29:21.70
Droege, Sam
Have more likely to be thought of as ohh I've got a mega Kylie. Well, I'm gonna
show the hind legs here both to show the tibial spur.
0:29:21.240 --> 0:29:21.730
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:29:21.990 --> 0:29:34.940
Droege, Sam
And to also show the tibial sphericals. So the sphericals are basically bumps
kind of cheese grater. Hey, I would call it that.
0:29:36.120 --> 0:29:56.780
Droege, Sam
A little bit confusing when you just read about it sometimes, but basically
this is a decent shot laterally cause you can see how they stand out. So this
is the surface of the tibia and there's just a whole series of bumps sphericals
on them. I don't think they have hairs coming out.
0:29:57.540 --> 0:30:1.930
Droege, Sam
And you can see when we look more straight on, I'll try and bring this in there.
0:30:3.570 --> 0:30:7.920
Droege, Sam
And make it Kylie would not have that. It would be smooth to pitted I guess.
0:30:8.860 --> 0:30:10.170
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, it's pretty distinct.
0:30:14.60 --> 0:30:14.230
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Here.
0:30:10.350 --> 0:30:20.180
Droege, Sam
Another another reasonable character, if you got to looking at it again, you're
not necessarily drawn to looking at that segment right away.
0:30:21.50 --> 0:30:21.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The.
0:30:21.970 --> 0:30:25.620
Droege, Sam
Now the native with her opsis.
0:30:26.440 --> 0:30:31.380
Droege, Sam
Umm, species has. I don't know if I can see it in this particular.
0:30:31.940 --> 0:30:32.280
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The.
0:30:33.60 --> 0:30:33.900
Droege, Sam
View.
0:30:34.780 --> 0:30:39.820
Droege, Sam
I'll change it if I can't. Has really thick and curved at the tip.
0:30:40.730 --> 0:30:44.190
Droege, Sam
Umm hind tibia. This one is not showing up.
0:30:45.20 --> 0:30:45.620
Droege, Sam
Me.
0:30:47.760 --> 0:30:48.630
Droege, Sam
Flip it over.
0:30:49.480 --> 0:30:50.980
Droege, Sam
I know that maybe was the 8th.
0:30:50.140 --> 0:30:54.230
Maffei, Clare J
Is that cheese grater? Anything. Just for gibbosa or like is that an all?
0:30:55.950 --> 0:30:56.270
Maffei, Clare J
Cool.
0:30:58.400 --> 0:30:58.700
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:30:53.740 --> 0:31:6.60
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No, they all they all have it. Yeah. To a greater or lesser degree. I mean,
it's very conspicuous and presumably it's for bracing or moving around within
the confines of a natural cavity.
0:31:8.290 --> 0:31:9.170
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That's just a guess.
0:31:11.530 --> 0:31:12.10
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:31:9.750 --> 0:31:25.960
Droege, Sam
I'm moving to apicals because I believe that this was easier and so you can see
actually this one's interesting because I have another specimen that doesn't
have this Gray tip to it, but that Gray I think is is earth or something that
it got.
0:31:27.850 --> 0:31:28.810
Droege, Sam
Covered with.
0:31:30.510 --> 0:31:49.120
Droege, Sam
Well, I was doing so. This is the app, so we'll back up so you can see some
really good sized sphericals. See all the bumps all along here Spiritualized.
And then this hind tibia. The main thing is it's curved at the tip pretty strongly.
0:31:50.340 --> 0:31:58.300
Droege, Sam
They they say it's sticker, it is in comparison to leathergoods Chrysler is.
But you know that's thick, is a relative term so.
0:31:58.840 --> 0:32:20.690
Droege, Sam
Umm, you know, don't bank on that as much unless you have a big collection. But
this curve thing is another key indicator that you have a native species rather
than the the the still very rare Christ serious in terms of outside of its
current area. But like we said, could show up anytime.
0:32:22.990 --> 0:32:35.340
Droege, Sam
All right. So and you can see, although it's very late now that as Mike
mentioned, this has got a nice bright yellow orange. But although that colors
are blown out.
0:32:36.0 --> 0:32:38.260
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Where does that specimen from saying, you know?
0:32:38.360 --> 0:32:40.640
Droege, Sam
You know, I think it's, I'm pretty sure this is South Dakota.
0:32:41.590 --> 0:32:42.340
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ah.
0:32:44.440 --> 0:32:44.790
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:32:46.250 --> 0:32:46.510
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:32:43.140 --> 0:32:48.550
Droege, Sam
So yeah, South Dakota, this was part of our BADLAND study. This is a monster
specimen.
0:32:49.320 --> 0:32:49.900
Droege, Sam
I should say.
0:32:51.350 --> 0:32:51.870
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I think.
0:32:51.240 --> 0:32:53.340
Droege, Sam
Unless it's. Unless it's not that species.
0:32:55.370 --> 0:32:55.670
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:32:56.610 --> 0:32:57.160
Droege, Sam
But it's.
0:32:53.390 --> 0:32:59.0
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No, no, that's what it is. Yeah. And they tend to. They are big. Yeah,
definitely.
0:32:58.600 --> 0:33:1.990
Droege, Sam
Yeah, it's quite a bit bigger than the.
0:33:2.490 --> 0:33:3.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Literal Alice.
0:33:2.950 --> 0:33:5.550
Droege, Sam
Bosa or chrysorrheus?
0:33:6.930 --> 0:33:8.740
Droege, Sam
This particular specific I only had a few.
0:33:8.400 --> 0:33:10.420
Maffei, Clare J
And you have this is apicalis you said.
0:33:10.510 --> 0:33:11.670
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yes. Yeah.
0:33:11.470 --> 0:33:11.800
Maffei, Clare J
Got it.
0:33:16.510 --> 0:33:17.190
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, and there's.
0:33:21.340 --> 0:33:22.770
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ohh yeah, there you go.
0:33:25.630 --> 0:33:25.920
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Little.
0:33:10.310 --> 0:33:28.510
Droege, Sam
This is apicalis I think apicalis is probably referring to this fuzzy **** and
you can kind of see at what Mike was talking about just at the very end. Here's
the slot and there's that pygidial plate. I'm gonna.
0:33:27.850 --> 0:33:33.280
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Which doesn't look like a plate at all. I mean, it's very it's spinning like to
me. I mean, you know.
0:33:33.960 --> 0:33:34.300
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:33:33.40 --> 0:33:35.130
Droege, Sam
Umm, yeah, like a poker.
0:33:35.530 --> 0:33:42.650
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. So there's another subspecies of apicalis in Southern California or in
Mexico.
0:33:43.170 --> 0:33:43.480
Droege, Sam
Hmm.
0:33:44.210 --> 0:33:44.740
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And.
0:33:45.980 --> 0:33:49.110
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I don't know if it's still legitimate, legitimate one or not, but.
0:33:51.290 --> 0:33:55.810
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But all the ones in the Great Plains look exactly like the one you got there.
That. Oh yeah, that's nice.
0:33:56.510 --> 0:34:0.80
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Done reddish orange, T6 and the females.
0:34:8.300 --> 0:34:16.60
Droege, Sam
OK. Was there something more about gibbosa we should talk about or cause
apicalis is in your next is your next species?
0:34:16.380 --> 0:34:16.950
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:34:18.230 --> 0:34:28.840
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No, but I I mean I think you you emphasized that I wonder if it's a sandal with
it, give Bosa, it's sure it's distribution sure seems that way.
0:34:29.200 --> 0:34:29.500
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:34:30.0 --> 0:34:31.250
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Which is kind of curious.
0:34:32.600 --> 0:34:33.970
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So the others.
0:34:49.660 --> 0:34:49.920
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:34:33.450 --> 0:35:3.660
Droege, Sam
Yeah, we're waiting it. It hasn't even shown up, for example, yet in Virginia
anywhere. And the, the other thing is that mostly the populations of prickly
pear in the coastal plain areas, which that distribution showed as coastal
plain, those are almost all in sand because any other place they just get out
immediately outcompeted and it becomes a some other sort of vegetation type in
the mountains.
0:35:10.490 --> 0:35:10.750
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No.
0:35:17.440 --> 0:35:18.350
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, and those are.
0:35:19.380 --> 0:35:19.820
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:35:20.550 --> 0:35:21.30
Mike Arduser (Guest)
There could.
0:35:3.730 --> 0:35:34.410
Droege, Sam
You know, interestingly you can go into West Virginia and other places and
you'll find prickly pear on rock rock ledges, basically the same kind of thing
of glades. I mean, who knows? There could be something up there, but you can
find. So I remember once I was along doing a survey route for birds and West
Virginia. And I came across this rock face. It was, it was. It was not a.
0:35:34.790 --> 0:35:50.230
Droege, Sam
The right angles rock face. It was just a sort of a rock plane that went up
about 45 degrees and it was just mostly rock. But in the in between were cacti
and the cracks and.
0:35:53.400 --> 0:35:53.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Hmm.
0:35:52.20 --> 0:36:8.280
Droege, Sam
Red cedar and I thought those red cedar, I bet are incredibly old. So I found a
stick that one of the red header had dropped in in an area about the size of,
you know, maybe two or three inches. It was 300 years old.
0:36:13.140 --> 0:36:13.610
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:36:24.100 --> 0:36:24.420
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:36:30.170 --> 0:36:30.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep, Yep.
0:36:32.380 --> 0:36:32.940
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:36:34.950 --> 0:36:35.220
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:36:8.990 --> 0:36:36.810
Droege, Sam
So who knows what that how old those things were basically old growth. And so
it's I think some of these kinds of things are interesting because they would
maintain themselves over long periods of time because they're so harsh. Those
barrens, like I've been to those Tennessee ones too. And it's like, man, how
can you even survive here? But a few things can and including. That's where I
see cacti. And you would never expect to see them in.
0:36:48.180 --> 0:36:48.900
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:36:38.700 --> 0:36:50.360
Droege, Sam
West Virginia. But there are a whole series of barrens, particularly on the
rain shadow side of Appalachia. But now you got me thinking that maybe those
need to be looked at a little bit more.
0:36:50.560 --> 0:36:51.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I would think so.
0:36:52.330 --> 0:36:52.850
Mike Arduser (Guest)
That'd be quite.
0:36:53.420 --> 0:36:55.920
Maffei, Clare J
So. So I'm hearing that we're gonna have a lab field trip.
0:36:56.860 --> 0:37:2.490
Droege, Sam
I'm sure I'm actually my old buddy is he's totally into Virginia.
0:37:3.810 --> 0:37:11.30
Droege, Sam
Mountain Baron. So he would love to take us around. In fact, he's invited us.
So now we have even more reason to.
0:37:14.590 --> 0:37:21.140
Droege, Sam
All right, so gibbosa, I mean, uh, so we're largely finished with gibbosa and.
0:37:20.920 --> 0:37:22.80
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I think so, yeah.
0:37:21.950 --> 0:37:29.420
Droege, Sam
OK, so next is apicalis which I have on deck and then the other two, I won't
have specimens of, but.
0:37:31.300 --> 0:37:32.360
Droege, Sam
What are we looking at here?
0:37:31.30 --> 0:37:56.600
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So so one of the key, yeah, one of the one of the key things with apicalis
females is what Sam is just showing that the reddish orange pubescence on
behind that and T6 the others in the key nothing it's always black or blackish.
So it's not, it's not like you need to have a certain viewing angle or certain
lighting it's it's a good field character for your call. Let's do that and you
can see it obviously with the naked eye.
0:37:58.430 --> 0:37:58.780
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:38:0.190 --> 0:38:18.690
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And then also there is a male or space, then you has this pit and it's kind of
irregular and rugged, but it it's not something necessarily see in the field,
but it should show up under the scope pretty well it's and it's.
0:38:18.980 --> 0:38:25.130
Droege, Sam
You can already see the UM the horn like projection on the.
0:38:22.990 --> 0:38:27.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Ohh, there we go. Over. Yeah. Now that's good too.
0:38:26.280 --> 0:38:32.190
Droege, Sam
Thing. I'm gonna go bump up a little light and so we can see to the interior
there.
0:38:33.480 --> 0:38:34.540
Droege, Sam
I can find it.
0:38:39.930 --> 0:38:45.270
Droege, Sam
Where the heck what happened to my? Oh, there it is. I have to get out of here.
0:38:47.710 --> 0:38:49.820
Droege, Sam
Because it'll be good to see that.
0:38:51.130 --> 0:38:53.20
Droege, Sam
Male or space character?
0:38:53.760 --> 0:38:55.160
Droege, Sam
That we need a little more light in there.
0:38:56.350 --> 0:38:57.870
Droege, Sam
Just gonna really overdo it.
0:39:2.980 --> 0:39:6.790
Droege, Sam
All right. So I'll get a little more.
0:39:8.620 --> 0:39:10.90
Droege, Sam
Intense here.
0:39:14.150 --> 0:39:18.790
Droege, Sam
So Mike, is this the, is this the mallor space? Is that all malar space there?
0:39:17.590 --> 0:39:20.580
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, it is. Yeah. Yeah, I think, yeah.
0:39:19.710 --> 0:39:20.860
Droege, Sam
That's pretty significant.
0:39:21.270 --> 0:39:22.370
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, it's.
0:39:22.120 --> 0:39:23.970
Droege, Sam
It's not like those damn andrina.
0:39:32.900 --> 0:39:33.280
Droege, Sam
Uh-huh.
0:39:35.290 --> 0:39:35.790
Droege, Sam
Right here.
0:39:26.910 --> 0:39:38.530
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And you can see the the there's that pit below. It doesn't show up well in that
image, but that where your where your ex is, that's you're right. You're right
on top of that depression. Yeah.
0:39:38.220 --> 0:39:38.620
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:39:39.260 --> 0:39:40.460
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And it just doesn't show up well.
0:39:41.700 --> 0:39:43.150
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But it's, you know.
0:39:44.480 --> 0:39:49.770
Droege, Sam
Is that similar to where the, umm, some of the osmia species like lignaria
have?
0:39:47.920 --> 0:39:51.810
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It is. It is in, in a general sense. Yeah, yeah.
0:39:59.930 --> 0:40:0.180
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:39:51.890 --> 0:40:5.860
Droege, Sam
So for some reason, there's maybe muscles or whatever that are better attached
perhaps to, you know, to pit. So this whole area right here is basically
concave. Is that kind of what's going on?
0:40:4.470 --> 0:40:16.780
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, that's correct. Yeah. Yeah. And then there's a kind of the post. There's
a posterior margin that in some specimens is carinate and some not quite so
much. But there's always an edge.
0:40:17.660 --> 0:40:18.70
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:40:19.270 --> 0:40:20.10
Droege, Sam
It is.
0:40:17.490 --> 0:40:20.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I promise to that posterior to that to that.
0:40:22.860 --> 0:40:26.230
Droege, Sam
Yeah, let's see if I can change.
0:40:26.980 --> 0:40:28.420
Droege, Sam
The angle here a little bit.
0:40:29.750 --> 0:40:30.980
Droege, Sam
And get something.
0:40:34.120 --> 0:40:38.900
Droege, Sam
Move sideways on that so we can see into that area.
0:40:54.60 --> 0:40:54.440
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Goodnight.
0:40:56.70 --> 0:40:59.570
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, you can. Kind of you can kind of see in a general way, there's that
depression.
0:41:0.280 --> 0:41:9.540
Mike Arduser (Guest)
We have button below the lower end of the eye and then you had it in focus and
then it go, there's a irregular edge or crying almost right along the.
0:41:10.860 --> 0:41:14.950
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The posterior margin of it. Yep. Yep, that's it. That's it. Yep.
0:41:12.70 --> 0:41:20.120
Droege, Sam
So here is that the Carina. OK. And it looks like there might be a shadow of
one there. So this is actually quite an extensive cavity.
0:41:20.250 --> 0:41:21.780
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It is, yeah, it's yeah.
0:41:22.440 --> 0:41:24.520
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And the other two species that are in the key.
0:41:26.190 --> 0:41:26.880
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Are.
0:41:27.810 --> 0:41:30.950
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Have something like that, but nowhere near that dramatic.
0:41:31.530 --> 0:41:31.880
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:41:32.800 --> 0:41:54.700
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And then the Super, super critical process or is in the other two species is in
a general way similar to this that is it's like a pair of horns, more or less,
they're all subtly different. But in general, the other two species had the
same kind of a process on the Super clinical area.
0:42:2.170 --> 0:42:3.700
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep, Yep, Yep.
0:41:55.240 --> 0:42:5.970
Droege, Sam
So there's a it's sort of a a horn projecting almost like a tooth and then a
valley and then another one will change the angle. Here a little bit.
0:42:7.480 --> 0:42:10.200
Droege, Sam
And see if that shows up again.
0:42:16.60 --> 0:42:21.130
Droege, Sam
Yeah, this is nice to have such dramatic differences sometimes.
0:42:28.990 --> 0:42:29.760
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:42:29.810 --> 0:42:30.130
Droege, Sam
2.
0:42:32.810 --> 0:42:33.370
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, this.
0:42:31.970 --> 0:42:33.880
Droege, Sam
So here's the three prongs.
0:42:34.610 --> 0:42:36.480
Droege, Sam
And but you can't miss that.
0:42:37.440 --> 0:42:39.290
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, these are cool. Very cool bees.
0:42:41.320 --> 0:42:46.760
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So the other two species that literalis and we're calling Ozark lenses for the
time being.
0:42:47.520 --> 0:43:3.520
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The face is similar. They have out of the roughly similar super quick real
process. So that in itself doesn't separate either callous, except when you
compare all three of them, they're subtly different, but.
0:43:4.530 --> 0:43:6.590
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Almost have to see all three depreciate it.
0:43:8.160 --> 0:43:25.200
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So on that apicalis is the one that it's in the Great Plains and pretty much
hasn't been found east of South Dakota or Kansas, Nebraska, Oklahoma, even
though there's cactus, it doesn't seem to have moved E that we know of.
0:43:26.370 --> 0:43:27.330
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You looking for it?
0:43:31.160 --> 0:43:34.210
Droege, Sam
And these two species, how are you separating those two?
0:43:34.980 --> 0:43:44.410
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm, the the Super Clypeal prominence like how I describe it is different when
you it's.
0:43:46.430 --> 0:43:48.600
Mike Arduser (Guest)
The horn parts diverge.
0:43:49.270 --> 0:43:54.520
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Or in literalists, and are more parallel, and those are census and.
0:43:55.380 --> 0:44:14.110
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It it's it's consistent. I've looked at enough of them enough so that it
doesn't vary, but you really need an illustration or a photo to really
understand what that means. But literalis they diverge the horns on that super
clipeus and then Ozark census. They're largely parallel.
0:44:14.940 --> 0:44:15.270
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:44:15.340 --> 0:44:18.330
Maffei, Clare J
It looks like the horns diverged here with.
0:44:18.140 --> 0:44:19.350
Mike Arduser (Guest)
They like the counts.
0:44:25.90 --> 0:44:26.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:44:19.960 --> 0:44:27.830
Maffei, Clare J
Yeah. So are we saying like the interior, like the sea part diverged more, or
is it actually like the whole angle of it like?
0:44:28.420 --> 0:44:29.590
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Both both Claire.
0:44:28.570 --> 0:44:31.310
Maffei, Clare J
Because it looked like with this one the the triangle.
0:44:32.80 --> 0:44:36.240
Maffei, Clare J
Like did have perpendicular external like right where that.
0:44:38.580 --> 0:44:47.170
Maffei, Clare J
Right where right where your pointer is. Those look pretty straight. Are you
saying for the diverging one? Like that's almost like a going out toward the
eye more.
0:44:47.490 --> 0:44:48.0
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yes.
0:44:49.150 --> 0:44:56.300
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And Sam mentioned this a little bit earlier, but these are three-dimensional
structures and depending on your viewing angle.
0:44:57.990 --> 0:45:13.0
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You can look a little different, so I'm trying to be specific in the key to
make sure people look at it from behind in profile. Then you can see those
differences between literalists and the Ozark, Kansas.
0:45:16.50 --> 0:45:20.220
Maffei, Clare J
And Sam, show us how to approach by your.
0:45:21.80 --> 0:45:21.710
Maffei, Clare J
Suggestion.
0:45:21.470 --> 0:45:26.710
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yes, if you if you get me look from behind. Sam, I think you did that earlier.
0:45:27.330 --> 0:45:27.600
Droege, Sam
And.
0:45:29.150 --> 0:45:31.380
Droege, Sam
This is more this is a little bit behind but.
0:45:32.710 --> 0:45:33.970
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Are you basically?
0:45:34.560 --> 0:45:38.340
Droege, Sam
I you wanted the totally bent over shot, right?
0:45:38.660 --> 0:45:39.480
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:45:51.900 --> 0:45:54.50
Droege, Sam
Maybe a little bit too much there.
0:46:2.50 --> 0:46:6.820
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I have illustrations to those things. I didn't think of think enough. I
should have said, sent them to you guys.
0:46:7.320 --> 0:46:8.360
Droege, Sam
Yeah, we can put them up.
0:46:9.170 --> 0:46:11.200
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK. And that's there. That's interesting.
0:46:15.690 --> 0:46:19.40
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I see from that profile. You can see how those were diverging.
0:46:22.890 --> 0:46:23.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You know there.
0:46:22.950 --> 0:46:24.360
Maffei, Clare J
Oh yeah, that looks very different.
0:46:24.980 --> 0:46:30.250
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. So that's it's, you know, these are still clear bicycle latifrons.
0:46:31.270 --> 0:46:31.570
Droege, Sam
Hmm.
0:46:32.490 --> 0:46:42.960
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So yeah, those are kind of diverging and that's the way literalis in general
looks, there's a deeper concavity between them.
0:46:44.740 --> 0:46:51.270
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It but in the Ozark Ensis ones, those are more obviously parallel. They don't
diverge like that.
0:46:51.970 --> 0:46:52.330
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So.
0:46:53.640 --> 0:46:53.930
Droege, Sam
Cool.
0:46:56.230 --> 0:47:10.400
Droege, Sam
My right. I just wanna go back to the so here. So this is the blue ones are the
the species literalis right.
0:47:11.190 --> 0:47:12.280
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
0:47:11.980 --> 0:47:26.530
Droege, Sam
Yeah. And so there's just a few that have leaked over here, and you have a few
gibbosus that leak over. And then our gibbosa and then the new species is
basically known only from Missouri and Illinois at this point.
0:47:26.710 --> 0:47:32.300
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, Southern Missouri, the Ozarks, and I'm sure it's in Arkansas. I don't
know why it wouldn't be. We don't have any record.
0:47:31.740 --> 0:47:35.130
Droege, Sam
Right. We're gonna have to send young Chris out.
0:47:35.680 --> 0:47:39.230
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well, we've got, yeah, he's down there. There are a couple people now working.
0:47:42.130 --> 0:47:42.600
Droege, Sam
That's good.
0:47:43.260 --> 0:47:43.570
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:47:46.120 --> 0:47:47.590
Droege, Sam
Yeah. Yeah, right.
0:47:39.570 --> 0:47:47.850
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, assiduously in Arkansas, collect collecting, and they keep sending me
images all the time, and they're finding some interesting, interesting stuff.
0:47:49.550 --> 0:47:49.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Chris.
0:47:47.670 --> 0:47:50.340
Droege, Sam
Umm. What's his name? Little I can't.
0:47:50.760 --> 0:47:51.450
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Coleman little.
0:47:51.860 --> 0:47:52.160
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:47:53.200 --> 0:47:53.570
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:47:52.630 --> 0:47:55.560
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah, they're both. They're, they're.
0:47:56.540 --> 0:47:57.70
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Render it.
0:47:57.850 --> 0:47:58.550
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:47:56.830 --> 0:48:3.670
Droege, Sam
Do it. OK, alright. Always, always a empty spot in distributions there in
Arkansas.
0:48:2.750 --> 0:48:4.440
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I know, yeah, yeah.
0:48:5.630 --> 0:48:11.330
Droege, Sam
Alright, well, we're let's jump to the mails here and see how far we get.
0:48:13.160 --> 0:48:23.100
Droege, Sam
So in terms of mails, I have a meal apicalis no gibbosus Italy and the Chrysler
as we can skip for now so.
0:48:23.180 --> 0:48:30.290
Droege, Sam
Umm, I see that apicalis doesn't come out till later, but what do you wanna
tell about?
0:48:31.330 --> 0:48:31.520
Mike Arduser (Guest)
What?
0:48:30.370 --> 0:48:33.100
Droege, Sam
Umm, differentiating males?
0:48:32.580 --> 0:48:36.220
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well, yeah. UM, laborum is everything.
0:48:37.200 --> 0:48:38.440
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And.
0:48:40.440 --> 0:49:3.650
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It's it's, you know, if if if you can spread the mandibles, it will help. But
later I will go down the line. Literal is the first one in the mail key very
distinctive. And even with the mandibles only partly open, you can see that
there is a basically spine light process. You stick off the lower part of the
labrum, can't miss it. And none of the others have anything like that.
0:49:5.570 --> 0:49:9.510
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You just can't miss it. And so that's an easy one.
0:49:11.210 --> 0:49:15.460
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And another thing about all the males, the genitalia are.
0:49:18.610 --> 0:49:19.0
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:49:16.910 --> 0:49:25.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Not very useful, and they also the genitalia are the smallest in relation to
the size of the specimens of any B I've ever seen there minute.
0:49:33.490 --> 0:49:33.860
Droege, Sam
Great.
0:49:26.110 --> 0:49:34.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
It's it's bizarre and I've never heard a good explanation for it. You know,
most mega Kylie genitalia are pretty significant, pretty big and chunky, these
are.
0:49:35.700 --> 0:49:38.700
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Tiny. I mean incredible anyway.
0:49:39.320 --> 0:49:57.70
Droege, Sam
Well, I wonder, you know, and interesting, I wonder if the relatively large,
let's call it pygidial plate, that the males have, which doesn't seem to serve
a particular purpose and cause it not building nests and things may have
something to do with that perhaps.
0:49:58.500 --> 0:49:59.810
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, I don't know.
0:50:1.720 --> 0:50:2.710
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK, so the labor room.
0:49:59.850 --> 0:50:3.610
Droege, Sam
Not sure what, but someone someone needs figured out.
0:50:7.700 --> 0:50:8.20
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:50:4.190 --> 0:50:17.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So the Lieberman little male literalis 2 spines can't miss him and gibbosa
mails the labrum at the base has a what I would just call it triangular
projection. It's not up spiny sharp thing, but it's just.
0:50:18.610 --> 0:50:19.570
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Conspicuous.
0:50:21.550 --> 0:50:24.680
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Projects in that goes from side to side and.
0:50:25.110 --> 0:50:31.670
Droege, Sam
Are you talking about like an andrina like triangular projection, or are you
talking about?
0:50:32.540 --> 0:50:32.900
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:50:30.420 --> 0:50:37.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Much, much more significant, much bigger, much more. You know, not something
you have to struggle to see.
0:50:37.950 --> 0:50:38.230
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:50:44.320 --> 0:50:44.580
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:50:38.680 --> 0:50:46.110
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And now the mandibles are closed. It's about it's a little it's not as obvious,
but it's still that you'll still see it.
0:50:46.900 --> 0:50:50.210
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And then the the Ozark anxious and apicalis.
0:50:53.780 --> 0:50:54.420
Droege, Sam
All right, I'm.
0:50:51.30 --> 0:50:59.580
Mike Arduser (Guest)
There's nothing going on with the labor there. No spines, there's no processes.
They're pretty much relatively.
0:51:0.330 --> 0:51:0.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Flat.
0:51:5.960 --> 0:51:6.370
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
0:51:3.520 --> 0:51:9.970
Droege, Sam
And hat. So how do you tell those two apart? I'm trying to get a a apicalis
male in focus here to see.
0:51:10.300 --> 0:51:12.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Pubescence is seems to be.
0:51:13.110 --> 0:51:26.240
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh reliable in apical is behind basic tarsi has a lot of light colored hairs.
TT6 and T7T best and says light colored and then the Ozark ensis everything
black.
0:51:27.840 --> 0:51:28.180
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:51:27.730 --> 0:51:36.800
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And that doesn't seem to be any variation. At first we thought this Ozark
census thing was just a form or geographic variant of apicalis, but it clearly
isn't.
0:51:38.370 --> 0:51:39.270
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And so.
0:51:41.350 --> 0:51:41.810
Droege, Sam
Well.
0:51:43.220 --> 0:51:51.360
Droege, Sam
Here's where we could have used the mark arduous or spread all mandibles of
megachile lady approach.
0:51:52.440 --> 0:51:53.840
Droege, Sam
But you can see.
0:51:56.270 --> 0:51:58.290
Droege, Sam
A bit, which is, you know.
0:51:59.20 --> 0:52:12.800
Droege, Sam
Like a lot of times, you spend a lot of time if you're not spreading mandibles
kind of peering in there. Is this a process at all right there or is it really
just complete and you can see very nicely the three teeth here, but.
0:52:13.950 --> 0:52:14.790
Droege, Sam
And you really.
0:52:13.840 --> 0:52:19.110
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well, on both both apicalis and those Arkansas, there's a very, very low.
0:52:23.100 --> 0:52:23.740
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:52:26.240 --> 0:52:26.860
Droege, Sam
OK so.
0:52:27.540 --> 0:52:30.240
Droege, Sam
So that might be at peeking out right there. Yeah.
0:52:33.70 --> 0:52:33.490
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:52:37.300 --> 0:52:37.660
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:52:33.550 --> 0:52:40.330
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Like spines or it's just a very low, very low Ridge now, often hard to see
unless you got the manuals.
0:52:39.820 --> 0:52:43.510
Droege, Sam
I'm. I'm not gonna spend a lot of time trying to see into there.
0:52:43.950 --> 0:52:44.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
OK.
0:52:44.700 --> 0:52:46.400
Droege, Sam
We're obvious reasons, but.
0:52:47.260 --> 0:52:49.600
Droege, Sam
OK. So any other mail?
0:52:50.340 --> 0:52:53.970
Droege, Sam
Umm characters or things that talk about here?
0:52:56.510 --> 0:52:57.480
Droege, Sam
Yeah, he's out.
0:52:58.380 --> 0:52:58.760
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:52:59.730 --> 0:53:0.70
Droege, Sam
But.
0:52:54.180 --> 0:53:5.900
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No, that's that's pretty much, you know from my perspective anyway that's yeah
and distributions too are important. I mean this new Ozark anxious thing, if
that's if we're correct.
0:53:6.830 --> 0:53:12.280
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And ate the cow is are geographically separated. You know, as far as we know.
0:53:14.380 --> 0:53:17.770
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So it's Literalis and Ozark enzymes that are.
0:53:21.380 --> 0:53:21.630
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:53:20.200 --> 0:53:26.980
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Saint Patrick and the mails are very different. Females are similar, but the
males are very, very different. So.
0:53:27.120 --> 0:53:37.570
Droege, Sam
At some, at some point, we're gonna have to just shift and bring in some, you
know, true Westerners to cover some of these, and then we'll find out, you know
how.
0:54:1.180 --> 0:54:1.430
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No.
0:53:38.810 --> 0:54:3.700
Droege, Sam
How good or bad some of these things are in terms of the guides that are
Western were built by people without me looking at, but I'm here for example, I
think is this was from the original guy, but I think it's probably going to
illustrate well. Let's see, this should be scored for two pointed basil spikes,
and that's probably your literalis so.
0:54:3.40 --> 0:54:4.70
Mike Arduser (Guest)
They're also, yeah.
0:54:4.780 --> 0:54:6.500
Droege, Sam
And so.
0:54:7.0 --> 0:54:7.980
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:54:9.110 --> 0:54:10.870
Droege, Sam
So this.
0:54:17.210 --> 0:54:18.260
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I'm not.
0:54:11.570 --> 0:54:20.740
Droege, Sam
Would appear to be the. Is it this flare out? Is that the end of the labrum?
And this is the base of the labor room. And those are the spikes.
0:54:19.500 --> 0:54:22.370
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I'm yeah. Yeah, I think that's what it's supposed to be.
0:54:22.960 --> 0:54:23.280
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:54:23.530 --> 0:54:29.30
Mike Arduser (Guest)
This diagrammatic, but yeah, that's I mean that and those spikes are they're
very spiky. I mean you're not going to miss.
0:54:30.400 --> 0:54:33.960
Droege, Sam
And then this one is probably your.
0:54:33.950 --> 0:54:34.780
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, gibbosa.
0:54:34.930 --> 0:54:49.130
Droege, Sam
Gibbosa let me click this off here and just we can just see if the guide has a
right. What has gibbosa and then these other ones are not scored for it. So or
though it's possible.
0:54:50.160 --> 0:54:52.200
Droege, Sam
That these also have.
0:54:52.990 --> 0:54:53.900
Droege, Sam
That so?
0:54:54.860 --> 0:55:2.390
Droege, Sam
Well, no, it's these are scored. These four are scored for having this cause.
That's what the has button means.
0:55:2.800 --> 0:55:3.620
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Right. OK.
0:55:4.390 --> 0:55:5.390
Droege, Sam
But I'm still.
0:55:4.640 --> 0:55:8.80
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, those are what I don't. Those are Western ones. I don't know well, so.
0:55:7.470 --> 0:55:22.480
Droege, Sam
Yeah. Alright, so here here this looks like again this one looks like the
compared to this one the the the triangular parts are further down.
0:55:23.900 --> 0:55:24.990
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:55:25.950 --> 0:55:31.140
Mike Arduser (Guest)
I guess you could say that I've been also the ones I've seen there, but the
triangular part is a little more conspicuous than that.
0:55:31.680 --> 0:55:32.90
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:55:32.0 --> 0:55:33.370
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, you know a little bigger.
0:55:35.740 --> 0:55:36.990
Mike Arduser (Guest)
But still it's very pair.
0:55:37.750 --> 0:55:38.140
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:55:39.880 --> 0:55:44.560
Droege, Sam
Alright, we're probably out of time. What do we got here, Claire?
0:55:45.210 --> 0:55:46.570
Maffei, Clare J
We are out of time.
0:55:47.40 --> 0:55:47.470
Droege, Sam
OK.
0:55:52.670 --> 0:55:52.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:55:48.530 --> 0:55:53.580
Droege, Sam
Uh, any questions other than where to go to find these things?
0:55:54.890 --> 0:55:55.450
Droege, Sam
Which is this.
0:55:56.760 --> 0:55:57.0
Droege, Sam
Here.
0:55:54.730 --> 0:55:57.320
Maffei, Clare J
Now the chats quiet if anybody has something.
0:55:58.460 --> 0:56:18.370
Droege, Sam
It's just a magical little group. You know, one of these ones that I know that
both Mike and I are really enjoy hunting for and thinking about because you're
not gonna find it in a cornfield or in the middle of a city except for
obviously cruceros. And even that finding that is of interest in the opposite
end of the spectrum from.
0:56:19.20 --> 0:56:24.310
Droege, Sam
You know, high quality natural areas, which is where most of these things are,
although I did find.
0:56:26.0 --> 0:56:35.770
Droege, Sam
Uh gibbosus wants in North Carolina in someones lawn, but their lawn was so
weedy and they actually had prickly pear in it and it was in the.
0:56:37.340 --> 0:56:42.750
Droege, Sam
You know that the place some the southern Pines that area.
0:56:44.860 --> 0:56:45.650
Droege, Sam
Super Sandy.
0:56:45.920 --> 0:56:46.250
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
0:56:47.760 --> 0:56:49.70
Droege, Sam
So who knows?
0:56:50.770 --> 0:56:51.380
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Gotta look.
0:56:51.870 --> 0:56:52.160
Droege, Sam
Yep.
0:56:52.440 --> 0:56:52.880
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Outlook.
0:56:55.650 --> 0:56:56.310
Maffei, Clare J
OK, well.
0:56:55.980 --> 0:56:56.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well.
0:56:57.210 --> 0:57:5.370
Maffei, Clare J
Thanks. Should we come back to this next week or we don't really have any more
specimens? Do we want to next week do a?
0:57:6.610 --> 0:57:10.940
Maffei, Clare J
Like an open house, ask questions, or do we want to move on to a new family?
0:57:12.420 --> 0:57:13.850
Droege, Sam
I I don't know.
0:57:12.730 --> 0:57:16.580
Maffei, Clare J
Where I think we started a new family, but no, we didn't. Yeah.
0:57:24.710 --> 0:57:25.40
Maffei, Clare J
Yeah.
0:57:30.240 --> 0:57:30.810
Maffei, Clare J
When they're not.
0:57:15.50 --> 0:57:47.780
Droege, Sam
I I think you should send out an e-mail. Claire. My suggestion would be to send
out an e-mail and see if people want that or whether they'd rather just us, you
know, walk through these things as we go. I'm, you know, because people have
opportunity to ask questions and a lot of times there aren't any, but they also
may have, you know, another thing we could do perhaps is have people submit
pictures of things or like, I've got a mystery thing. Here's a set of pictures.
Or if they have the ability, they could share like we're doing.
0:57:48.860 --> 0:58:3.800
Droege, Sam
With a a thing and then you know, we could try to see SI it although I'm not so
great with pictures. But you know, at least we could talk about what we're
looking for and why we're looking at it, that kind of thing.
0:58:4.360 --> 0:58:5.80
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, that would be good.
0:58:5.620 --> 0:58:11.290
Droege, Sam
If people are interested, so it'd be fun to just, you know, take a break from
an actual.
0:58:11.880 --> 0:58:12.430
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:58:13.70 --> 0:58:18.460
Droege, Sam
Uh set of specimens and ask people to bring in, bring in their dead, so to
speak.
0:58:26.860 --> 0:58:28.320
Droege, Sam
Yeah, OK. Alright.
0:58:20.540 --> 0:58:32.530
Maffei, Clare J
OK, I'll send out an e-mail about that. I think I'm not going to write a poll
because there are 400 something people on this e-mail chain, but I will maybe
that's just what we'll do next week and hopefully people will show up.
0:58:36.610 --> 0:58:36.940
Maffei, Clare J
Yeah.
0:58:31.260 --> 0:58:54.140
Droege, Sam
Yeah, questions and questions and pictures or cool or even just cool things,
you know, like we're we're into that like ohh look, I found this where it's not
supposed to be. And sometimes that's exactly just the coolest thing ever. And
everyone was like, umm, maybe it's not that or something. So mysteries of all
kinds perhaps.
0:58:56.140 --> 0:58:57.260
Maffei, Clare J
Sounds quite good.
0:59:1.240 --> 0:59:1.520
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Hey.
0:58:59.70 --> 0:59:1.640
Maffei, Clare J
Well, thank you. My believe you with us next week.
0:59:2.440 --> 0:59:3.50
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh.
0:59:5.550 --> 0:59:6.420
Maffei, Clare J
Yay.
0:59:8.70 --> 0:59:8.560
Droege, Sam
You're right.
0:59:4.120 --> 0:59:11.660
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yes, I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I was gonna say we're we're starting to work
on abuse of Iowa thing, Sam.
0:59:12.290 --> 0:59:14.390
Mike Arduser (Guest)
So got a bunch.
0:59:15.420 --> 0:59:16.20
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well.
0:59:11.980 --> 0:59:16.520
Droege, Sam
Woo. Ohh. Nice. Who's who's the? Who's the group doing that?
0:59:19.620 --> 0:59:20.20
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:59:16.950 --> 0:59:22.830
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, you know, do Hendricks and Amy Toth and don't you other people.
0:59:23.450 --> 0:59:24.660
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Uh, so?
0:59:26.0 --> 0:59:26.640
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Well, I think.
0:59:23.400 --> 0:59:27.550
Droege, Sam
Wow, I haven't heard from Steve in years. It's good to hear that he's in the
game.
0:59:31.700 --> 0:59:32.50
Droege, Sam
Mm-hmm.
0:59:33.770 --> 0:59:34.90
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
0:59:27.890 --> 0:59:39.580
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. And we were we have a zoom meeting next week to kind of get the get the
ball rolling, I guess so yeah, it's the list so far has about 370 species, so.
0:59:41.970 --> 0:59:42.580
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, no.
0:59:46.760 --> 0:59:46.990
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yep.
0:59:39.820 --> 0:59:54.600
Droege, Sam
Wow. Wow. That's interesting. Yeah. There's some interesting pockets in some of
the right areas of Iowa that, you know, a little sand, a little little eastern
forest, a little High Plains. Yeah.
0:59:56.420 --> 0:59:56.660
Droege, Sam
Umm.
0:59:53.750 --> 1:0:0.410
Mike Arduser (Guest)
And the the last hills, you know, and the on the western margin, lot of rare,
the Great Plains stuff there, so.
1:0:0.0 --> 1:0:0.500
Droege, Sam
Yeah.
1:0:9.200 --> 1:0:9.610
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Wow.
1:0:1.930 --> 1:0:12.780
Droege, Sam
Well, at some point I have you down on my list to review the bees of Maryland,
but I'm writing every morning, so I've gotten through. I just have.
1:0:13.180 --> 1:0:43.730
Droege, Sam
Uh. The rest of helicity, which of course is huge and the struggle of what to
do with some of these dialects and Megachile Andy and then validity. And I'll
have species accounts done and I'm gonna send those out because I'm talking
about. I'm trying to do a lot of life, not Natural History in a little more
wordy or section and food habits and a little more extensive and then.
1:0:49.50 --> 1:0:49.300
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Umm.
1:1:0.240 --> 1:1:0.950
Mike Arduser (Guest)
No. Yeah.
1:0:43.830 --> 1:1:3.620
Droege, Sam
Umm, the the range within North America too. So I'm gonna send it out to a
whole bunch of people, but I'm gonna save you for last cause I'll ask to see if
you can do a, you know, more full review and then you'll have everyone else's
comments too, if that's OK. It's still, it's gonna be months, but really.
1:1:2.230 --> 1:1:4.670
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah. Yeah, no, yeah, I'd be be.
1:1:5.110 --> 1:1:5.990
Droege, Sam
Really on the roll.
1:1:5.450 --> 1:1:7.220
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Happy. Delighted to do that so.
1:1:7.480 --> 1:1:9.630
Droege, Sam
Yeah, no, lots of fun.
1:1:12.740 --> 1:1:13.210
Mike Arduser (Guest)
If we got.
1:1:10.310 --> 1:1:16.120
Droege, Sam
Fun digging around and then you've got just mysteries that trying to resolve.
1:1:14.660 --> 1:1:17.410
Mike Arduser (Guest)
You got through Perdita yet. Have you done? Done the perdita.
1:1:19.330 --> 1:1:19.550
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah.
1:1:18.460 --> 1:1:20.160
Droege, Sam
Yeah. Now we don't have it.
1:1:21.510 --> 1:1:21.980
Mike Arduser (Guest)
We gotta go.
1:1:19.540 --> 1:1:24.970
Maffei, Clare J
I'm just gonna say I'm I'm gonna stop the recording, cause I'm gonna need to
get the kid, but you guys keep talking. Go have fun.
1:1:24.450 --> 1:1:34.280
Droege, Sam
OK, I was gonna say we don't have that many Purdue and we have a lot of several
that are, you know, 1Z2Z kinds of things.
1:1:35.800 --> 1:1:43.800
Droege, Sam
And, but yeah, it's not. It's not Perdido rich, but we have, you know, cool
things like Bradley, I and.
1:1:43.830 --> 1:1:44.670
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
1:1:45.520 --> 1:1:46.770
Droege, Sam
And then.
1:1:51.380 --> 1:1:53.100
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Oh yeah, that's a good one. I've never seen that.
1:1:47.930 --> 1:1:53.320
Droege, Sam
Yeah, I can't even remember Nova Angley. And I just, you know, a couple.
1:1:57.570 --> 1:1:57.910
Mike Arduser (Guest)
Mm-hmm.
1:1:54.50 --> 1:2:20.660
Droege, Sam
Couple couple with a couple records Georgica couple records, then some stuff
that I'm still on the fence with that I have called Bradley I, which I think it
is. But you know there's this all the graduation and the manipulations from
boltonia to Bradley I are, you know, a Contra moving target on some ways so.