Learn to ID Bees-20240710_130441-Meeting Recording

July 10, 2024, 5:04PM

56m 54s

Maffei, Clare J started transcription

Droege, Sam 0:12
We're gonna go to this file, which I think should be visible now, and this is an Excel file that clear of sent out to everyone and you can use discover life and certainly has this information, but not as detailed.
So to repeat what we mentioned last time and just says a little bit of an overview, this is held spreadsheet includes lots of differences between the species that are on the subtle end because it's a pretty subtle group.
So in some cases you have to weigh the evidence from several different places and look for the best fit based on a line of evidence that matches the best grouping from this.
This list here just because it's very difficult to be absolutely black and white about some of these things, but some of the characters are are quite nice.
But you know, sometimes only at the extreme.
So like when you have the depressed apical area, you know whether it's 60% or 75%.
Sometimes that's useful, but telling the difference between 60 and 75 unless you have comparative information is not that great, but it can help when you're trying to evaluate a bunch of different species and different factors.
So that's why the spreadsheet is here.
What you're looking at is umm, species are rows.
Characters are columns.
There's a little mini explanation of what we mean by the character at the very bottom of each of the character columns, there is a yellow highlighted cell that indicates that that particular character is something that, in combination with the other yellow highlighted characters in that species row, makes it distinctive.
In other words, that would be the first, but maybe not the only thing that you would look for if you suspect ohh, this might be nuda you would look and see.
Ohh, like the vertex height is pretty short compared to some of the others and so forth.
So we went through these in a lot of detail with using for Bessie I here as our model child to explain the category.
So we'll go through the rest of the species, nowhere near that level of detail.
If you want that detail, you want more information or examples, I would jump back to the last session.
Once that gets posted and if you missed it, clear mentioned there was some problems with things getting posted, but it's on the mint.
OK.
So seeing No 3 tends to be a northern species and I'm gonna show that here.
Oops, sorry.
When you click on the the species name, it will now jump to the species page on discover.
Life handy, but not what we wanted to do here.
So take it back.
So if we now go across, first of all, there's another little thing to remember like, here are the two most similar species.
It's doesn't have to be too.
It could be a set, but Miranda and Virginiana should be under consideration when you're looking at something you think might be seeing nothi.
If we look at what is it that makes helps create a distinct set of characters, we look at the yellow ones and we see that the fovea fat to thin ratio.
So again, fat is the thickest part, so the greatest width which would be up towards the aselli and the thinnest part would be down near the antenna bases and in this group often you can have and this is an indication for this one you can have a quite a dramatic fat to thin umm narrowing down.
Umm.
And almost like a thought balloon in a way.
So this one has a a quite dramatic one, so greater than three fovea description.
So this is highlighted also and you can't quite see it there, but if you look up at the top here says thin area nearly straight down to slightly boat thin area is very thin and deep just to slot.
So in this particular case, the narrow area also indicated by it being a roughly a greater than three to one difference in in the ratio is very narrow and very straight.
A lot of them are bowed and a lot of them are.
You know their narrower but not like really, really narrow.
So this is when I start using those comparative words.
That's problematic, right?
You don't really want to have narrower than what, right?
So if you have a lot of experience that makes sense.
If you don't, then hopefully some of these other characters that are a little more quantitative, shall we say, and not comparative or useful.
OK, let's look for some more yellow here.
And we're not really seeing anything until we get to pitting on T1.
So point 252.5 Pitts apart on average.
So what that means effectively is like this.
Really got dense pitting on T1, so we're looking for that.
Umm.
And here's just some hints.
The distribution is more eastern and northern I think, and here's a special feature.
It's not highlighted, so maybe not one of the ones to use in a definitive sense.
Pits on screwed them slightly larger than Miranda, so just a tip, something when you're doing comparative work.
All right, let's take a look at one in this case from West Virginia at a higher elevation.
We really don't see this much in Maryland, except in Western Maryland, and we will go here and bring the level down.
First of all, do look at some general things on this.
They were talking about the pitting on T1.
Let's zoom in on T1 here a little bit and we can see that.
Indeed, we do have quite dense pitting throughout throughout this area here, umm and move that out of my way.
So matches T1 has that we also were looking at fovea characteristics as being part of the identifications stream.
I moved it pretty quickly, but unlike some of the species, it has big white patches of hair, very dense, very white, and very noticeable.
On the abdominal sides of the abdominal tergites.
Again, that's often not used in a definitive way because it is, umm, sometimes difficult to see.
OK.
We'll move this around a couple times.
So you can see this.
What you're looking at here is the fovea that's running here.
And then there's the bottom part.
So here we have very wide filling up most of the space between the compound I and the ocelli.
And then you can kind of make it out as it crosses underneath the hairs here.
This is just a really narrow slot, so that's the ratio is this width at the roughly at the level of the umm internal sockets and the width up here towards the top or the greatest width which is up by the aselli certainly greater than three times wider up here than down there.
Let's move this a little and I'll also explode up this to full height fatigue control.
And you think S is the other magic that did something, but not what I was expecting.
Maybe have to do in here control shift F you know, control Alt F mastering it.
What was the?
There we go.
Four things I have to press.
Alright, so here we are.
We're looking at the left hand side now of the face.
And and the phobia again being very useful in this case as a marker for C Another so here we are very wide at the top, next down.
This is not this is a this neuro part of the phobia is a fair distance.
We can look on the Excel spreadsheets.
We'll flip to here, and if we're at see another again and we are looking at the.
This is a character that's useful in many things, but it wasn't highlighted here, so Max distance from removal I that's in terms of widths of the fovea.
At that point you can see that there is a fair amount of space in there, but it's not monstrously big and that additionally, this, uh, Fulvia narrow part is basically straight.
So in many of the other species, correctly I, which we'll see in a second, this is bowed this bottom part.

Maffei, Clare J 9:55
Sam, we just see you right now.

Droege, Sam 9:58
Or you do OK.
Did you see any of that before?
Did you see any of the bee?

Maffei, Clare J 10:06
Now it's been you for a while.

Droege, Sam 10:09
OK.
Did you see the spreadsheet?

Maffei, Clare J 10:11
Yes.

Droege, Sam 10:12
OK.
Alright, what about now?

Maffei, Clare J 10:15
We gotta be.

Droege, Sam 10:15
Do you see the beat?
You have a bee.
So did you ever see a bee or until now or not?

Maffei, Clare J 10:22
Previously we did and then spreadsheet and then talking face.

Droege, Sam 10:24
Are you did OK?
All right.
Huh.
Interesting.
OK, so anyway, the issue here is just the shape of the phobia and we have very wide to very narrow.
So that greater than three times difference, we have a very straight phobia below, not bent or curved.
Moderate distance from the rim of the eye and very crisp in its portrayal.
So those are the primary features of this species, and I'm not going to unless there's questions specifically about each of these.
I'm just going to highlight the key features for each, but you can and this may be where we went wrong.
I'm can you see the spreadsheet now?

Maffei, Clare J 11:18
We've got it.

Droege, Sam 11:20
OK, so if we are looking on the spreadsheet for CNOT and you're not 100% sure, maybe you're doing your comparison.
Remember we said Miranda and Virginia?
So we could look at virginiana and look for the differences here with that other one.
So for example, if we go to to that and it away.
We go.
You have to hear, I think maybe I clicked on that before.
OK.
I'm just talking to myself, so here we can see the difference between why does that?
I don't know.
Do you see the little icon getting in the way at all, or is that just something I see a square with the?
Presentation zoom session.
Shall we call it?
Jumping around on my screen, but do you see that or do you just see the spreadsheet OK all right, it's just my problem then.

Maffei, Clare J 12:15
No, just got your spreadsheet.

Droege, Sam 12:21
But if we look here you can see.
Ohh this has greater than three.
This is 223 so different but not greatly different.
This is part of this trip, so this one is here.
This character is important for Virginia, but doesn't really differentiate it from the other species.
Umm these are apps and also not differentiating CNO.
The this one also doesn't differentiate.
See.
Nothing.
Neither does that.
Umm, the proportion here we have this thing right?
This is .6.
This is .75, so a little bit more, but not a whole lot.
It'd be difficult to see these.
Don't differentiate.
This differentiate so this would be probably your key character 1.5 to 3 and this is the pitting on T1 we saw how close it was.
This is well spaced out, so that would probably be very, very definitive and and that was it.
So yeah.

Maffei, Clare J 13:27
Am for your room of I or any of these mosquitoes hitting any of the ones that are, umm, really specific.
Were you using a measuring tool or is this your eyeballing?

Droege, Sam 13:39
Eyeball we don't.
In general, our microscopes don't have measuring reticules and we also are trying to build guides and identification tools that don't require those kinds of things.
On those are useful and much more precise, and usually if you're looking at the literature, you're gonna be able to find that kind of thing.
But we're trying to reach a broader audience, so we haven't usually included those every once in a while will include them, but they're going to be derived from someone else's work.
Now, if that sufficiently answers that hit the species page again.

Maffei, Clare J 14:25
Yeah, it's just trying to remind it.

Droege, Sam 14:28
OK.
So we'll go to Heracles and tell me if I if the information on the screen disappears again, clear and we'll push it back.
OK, so erratically I I'm gonna remove my CNO 3 here and we'll look at this one.
OK.
So in our area, we see correctly eye reasonably regularly.
If we're looking at her exactly.
I we're looking again for a yellow, although we do take a note here and see that the F2 length it's not highlighted, but it is a bit different, but it includes one by one there, so maybe not that useful.
And whenever we were did it, we did not think of that as important.
This, though, is highlighted entirely smooth and glossy.
So what we're looking at is surface below central aselli.
So you know where that is?
Central ocelli is and so below, of course would be to even the antenna, and that a celli and in this case it's very smooth and glossy.
What else does it say up here?
Tiny pits much greater than one pit diameter apart versus something that has everything from striations in a few cases to heavily pitted, meaning pits less than one, and no mention of the smooth and glossy look.
So we'll look for that.
That's an important one.
We're looking at highlighted things and not being distracted by these others that can be used now.
Facial fovea thin area strongly bowed, so if we go back up here strongly in bowed in towards the antennae.
OK, remember see another.
The one we just looked at was essentially straight.
This one is highly bowed and if we look at the distance, which is the next one, and also highlighted it's 1.2 so and if we read down here in terms of this is how we this is where we explain what the character is talking about measured in units of the widths of the apex of the escape.
So I was wrong in terms of we weren't so that the apex of the escape is gonna be much more of a uniform across all the species measurement tool than the width of the movia, which varies in is something that's useful.
And we're actually talking about the distance between the eye and the rimmed.
Ohh, I'd the eye rim and the Fulvia at the level of the antenna.
So in this case very far away, highly bowed and we'll take a look at that and see if we can see that under the scope a little bit better, we're looking for more yellow areas skipping over many things.
And we see that pitting on on T1 also very close to 5 to .5 and that'll be important and its sister taxa telling it apart, which has very widely spaced bidding on team one.
And note about it being in the Mid Atlantic, it says uncommon.
I guess that's maybe true.
I thought it was pretty regular in our area, but perhaps not.
OK, let me pull that.
This so people don't think that we are some kind of like uh magicians and can identify everything.
I would just looking at an entire big chunk of endrina specimens that were labeled endrina interesting, meaning we this is a good specimen, but we have no idea what it is.
So correctly I.
Let's see if we have a nice looking one here.
And how about this one?
Just checking on my other thing got a lot of pollen on it.
Let's try another about that one.
Let's see. Reasonable.
Yeah.
He can.
We see.
Yeah, we can see that the face.
If the hair is matted quite a bit, this is a generic problem.
That's why washing and drying your specimens rather than pulling them out and pinning them up out of alcohol is so much better.
Umm.
If they're mattered a lot of times, important features like the facial phobia become obscured.
OK.
So we're gonna look at the face, and we're gonna look for this very shiny portion of the head.
OK, so hopefully.
We're seeing the microscope screen here.
And Claire will mention if it alright.

Maffei, Clare J 19:39
We have it.

Droege, Sam 19:41
Not there.
And so we're zooming in on the head and we're we're gonna do is look at the area and we'll we'll go when we go to the next and specimen or uh will mention this again.
But we're looking in this area, this is not showing up super well.
Umm.
And it's smooth and glossy.
Let's see if.
I'll try and get another specimen on on this one. Umm.
And.
We'll take a look at the phobia too.
It may be so glossy we're getting a lot of Sheen coming at.
This might be a better view, a little bit better.
But the fact that we're getting so much reflectance is an indicator of how.
Smooth the area is.
Have you feeling a different specimen will show this better?
Yeah.
And the pitting.
So this is this is the area here.
You.
It's again a little hard to see, but you can see that there is a fair amount of spacing between the pits, in other words not on top of each other.
Again, we'll try and get another another one to show this.
Facial fovea.
Here's the upper part.
Here's the lower part, that skinny, pretty distinctive.
And here's this bow.
OK, so here's this distance and we're looking at this scape as a measurement.
It's a little, you know, we have a parallax problem here with the microscope to really use that, but we're using the apex of the umm, our first segment of the antenna to measure this distance.
But this is bowed away and quite a distance.
Let's see if we can see that better on the other side.
We have.
You can see that pretty well.
So here's what we're looking at.
So here's the upper part.
So the wide part.
Here's the narrow part, and you can see that it bends away from the rim of the eye, and you have quite a big space between there, so that's part of the distinctive features.
And the other distinctive feature was the pretty close spacing.
You wanna say it?
It's hope it ponies are the other species has in its bit of association with wetlands.
But I'm not.
Maybe even Willow can't quite remember, but.
Is close pitting, so if we look at this, bring it up a little bit, you can see that the pits are quite close.
Very similar issue to maybe not quite as closely pitted as seeing nothing but quite dense and then if we look at T2, which wasn't one of the features, but I do want to point this out as useful a lot many times is you can see the oppressed area so the depressed part of the rim goes way the heck up there and you can see that if we are measuring these relative distances that we might say 80%, maybe even a little bit more of the total length of this rim is in the depressed state.
Look at the bright shiny side patches of apical hair bands.
Let's see what we have here again.
So we're on the row with correctly I and so smooth and glossy again.
And if we look at some of these other features, umm, what was it that we were noting that was the oppressed area?
I like looking at the pressed area.
It says actually 75%.
You know, we could see that plus or minus and ohh, so here's my notes about the hair bands.
It says none too vague and then and then a side note, maybe dense at times questionmark.
So and then here's the type pitting.
So in some of these kinds of situations, is there regional variation or was that where or are we looking at more than one species and we're not differentiating them well because it's very messy or to say, but we are very close right now.
I'm going to pull another specimen.
We're very close right now to having a molecular capabilities with nanopore technology to begin actually doing some species stuff, swing a little dirty again.
You.
That was more like 75%.
And see what I can find that look at that head feature again.
This is pretty good.
Umm.
Yeah.
Always more to learn on bees in terms of where they occur.
Plants.
They occur on and patterns, and it's made so much more tricky when there are difficult to identify.
So sometimes you get information about a species, but it's actually not that species.
Which is why we're doing these classes so that you aren't propagating misidentifications.
We're where is my little space?
There we go.
Alright, so we're going to zoom in on the head again from this far up.
And see if we can really can't.
Quite well.
You can't a little bit, so here.
Here's this bent part.
So where we have the curve showing up in terms of the dark patches away from the fovea, which is highly bend at the lower part and the upper part you maybe get a hint that you're seeing some glossy areas.
But again, we're getting.
So much reflection from here that it's obscuring some of what's going on.
Try and zoom all the way up that I can.
The pitying umm.
So if you look up here you can see there that there's sections.
It doesn't look like it's generic everywhere, but a lot of these sections that the pitting is umm about 1 apart.
Maybe that's not the best character and you can't really see this glossy nature of this area really well, so I apologize for that.
It is, though, noticeable under the microscope.
Well, look here at the Fulvia, this is happens all the time, right?
There's these long hairs and they flopped over the fovea.
You can see that this distance here is not like seeing movie, which was much narrower, but it is.
There is quite an extensive area because this curves up, that is just integument, not fovea.
Let's look on the other side.
Different angle.
And.
We can get this impression again too.
Here's an arrow phobia here.
This phobia curbs away.
You can see the relative distances between the irim and the fovea berries, but at its greatest maximum it's quite there's quite a gap.
And if you think about many other inrena if they've largely follow the edge of that rib, there's really not all this variation going on.
In T1, we don't need to look at that again.
Maybe it'll zoom out, but few I'm gonna focus on team one from here, but you get the point.
We saw at the last one T1 heavily pitted.
Feel free to interrupt about individual species if you have questions.
Otherwise, we're just gonna go through each.
I may not have all the umm species here, but if we go to hippotes.
Oops, don't it be clicking that thing.
We go to Hippotes and we go back and we look for the special thing.
The special thing is essentially orange tibia and tarsal segments really shows up, shows up in the mails too, with one of the few track endrina that I feel comfortable naming and.
Here under special features, I pressed areas of tourguides.
Sometimes, what does it say?
Appear sometimes with very sparse pitting.
I don't know if that's just something I noted and put here.
As a note, the key thing is this orangish color, and this is a relatively common species.
See.
Tonight. You have.
Yeah.
Get a specimen out.
Let me nose off screen.

Maffei, Clare J 30:20
What did you say?

Droege, Sam 30:22
As blowing my nose off screen, you think this isn't some high class video, and at least I did it off screen.

Maffei, Clare J 30:25
Oh great.

Droege, Sam 30:31
OK, so let's see if we can find this one looks good.
So yeah, these are sometimes very dominant member of the area.
I think we'll start with the face because we've been looking at some facial features and this has a pretty generic for the group and we can look at some of the.
Might be a little bit tricky on this specimen.
We can look at some of the, umm, features that contrast with the last two.
You can get to it.
OK so.
Recall that the other one we were making statements about the pits being a little bit wider than others and that the IT was shiny and glossy and smooth.
And this is pretty typical of almost all the others.
Is one other species that fits that shiny thing, and I'm afraid it just doesn't show well under the microscope setup that we are running.
And plus, there's oops antennal segments and things in the way.
See if I can get that back.
There we go.
But if you and again, I'll point this out several times because it is an important key character and is one of those things that you know it when you see it.
But a lot of times, if you don't see a hippotes or it's other species counterpart whose name I forget.
Ohh, you tend to try and make some of the ones that don't have glossy areas into it.
So here you can see a bit into that interior space where there's a lot of pits, there's some surface sculpturing going on.
It's certainly not just highly reflective, so you know, it's like a lot of this stuff on the back of the head too is pretty much the same and.
We'll look at more, but in this area in particular is where we're looking between the below, the central aselli and above the antennal segments on that.
Now let's take a look at the facial fovea as a contrast on here and you can see here's the fat area.
Here's the thin area, and here is the edge of the eye and first of all, the thin area is not so thin, right?
So I don't know what we put down there, but it's, you know, maybe if to be generous, maybe if and again we may have a a partially obscured specimen only twice the this is twice the width of that down there and there's almost no distance between the rim of the eye and if the lower part of the facial fovea, unlike the last specimen that we looked at.
So now the Super nice to have character on this species are the orange legs and you can see them right from here.
And it is.
It's not as subtle.
Character.
It is orange and we'll look at it maybe from the side to and so the tarsal segments and clean the base of Tarsis, which the X is on right now in the tibia are just plain old orange and the hairs are light.
They're not really orange, but the integument is orange, and so that shows up nicely.
You can see here some pretty generic other characteristics.
These are close, but not super close.
Pitting on T1, the oppressed area kind of difficult to see from this angle, but you're in the ballpark of 6070%.
Perhaps bright white edges and the species on terms of tergal hair bands, and I am going to pop in a male.
So at this point, when I early on when we were doing these guides and just identifying things, I just was having so much trouble finding good specimens of the males that I could trust.
List umm and the differences between them are even more subtle in my mind at least that I ended 2 not identify them, just leave them as track endrina species because it's pretty easy to identify at the track endrina level and I'm trying to get a good specimen here of a meal.
But in Hippotes you get, you know, a orangish.
Umm.
Coloration in here, particularly in the the here the switch shows it pretty well in the.
Partial segments per you the bazaars.
That said, there is.
So this is a meal.
It does have the classic track endrina.
Hmm.
Umm Proportial triangle with the raise line or Corina across the tip that separates it from the vertical face.
And here you can see in particular this is smugly yellow at the apical end and the basal end and a little bit of brown in the middle.
But this is clearly all orangey.
Yellow.
I should say orange instead of yellow tears coming into my eye myself.
And so that gives you a strong ID queue for that one the.
So that's one that I and you know they usually Co occur and they're usually quite common.
I'm going to try and get this specimen back in the camera and zoom in to show the proportial triangle, which is the strong identification characteristic for the group, but you have to be aware of ilicis, so I think we we do the separation in there alissas can also have this proportial triangle raised line separating the rear face.
It's a little dark in here.
Here's a proposal triangle area.
There's a raised line separating this upper surface, the dorsal surface from the umm.
Not so.
What's the ventral?
But the rear facing uh surface of the proposition that is facing T1, not a great look because of how dark it is in there, but yeah.

Maffei, Clare J 37:44
Hey, Sam.
We yeah elicits is not included on your spreadsheet.
So if when you're not like, we wanna go over it after this, that might be a good and yeah.

Droege, Sam 37:56
OK, we can and I probably even though it's not a track endrina, unless I'm grossly mistaken, it is something that has to be separated out from the track injury news because it has this a character here and also it's going to match in terms of Orange Leggedness the hippotes off the top of my head.
I can't remember how.
I know it's not that species or is that species and I do know that a lot of times I end up looking it up because I'm not sure it's a woodland I associate with woodland species.
OK, back to the spreadsheet.

Maffei, Clare J 38:36
The Ulysses or Hippotes?

Droege, Sam 38:39
Blisters. Hippotes.
I see just in lots of areas.
I think if it is open country, a lot of these track endrina are later in the season.
Then many of the umm, other endrina species is tend to be early spring found in Woodlands.
Some of these can be found in Woodlands, but a lot of these are open country species and can bleed right into August.
Umm, when I certainly a number of them are solid summer species, which is a, you know, unusual.
Uh.
Which are that are not 100% sure.
Umm, but you can look up things online.
OK, so this next one is oops, I keep clicking this PC, but OK, it didn't. Didn't kick me out.
Marie is a Willow specialist and in the Midwest, and I guess maybe the High Plains to the West of that, it's pretty clear to identify because it has a a nice orangey red abdomen.
But in the east, like the ones that I have identified, at least tentatively, are don't have that.
And this is noted in Umm the Burge who did the revision, or leverger students at forget who did track endrina.
Let's see if I can find it.
And so it makes it one that.
Because of.
This in between nature of having a dark abdomen, sometimes in a red abdomen, other times.
Umm, something that can trick you up, particularly if you're in an area where you have a lot of the red abdomen action.
So I'll I'll I do have a red abdomen 1 here, so I'm gonna bring it out to see to show what that looks like.
And there it is.
It is very red and it would have the other characters.
It would be like it's like chikodi's red, but it has andrina characteristics.
Wing venation and facial phobias and all that kind of good stuff.
And if we look back here on the proposal triangle.
Began in this this.
So here's the triangle right here.
Pretty nicely outlined and you can see a character that's used sometimes is how different is the surface sculpturing between the.
Area in interior to the triangle and exterior to the triangle, and in this particular case, which time do we have left 140?
OK.
Umm, so there's not a whole lot of difference.
So just pointing that out.
I'm not sure that's a key character here, but sometimes you'll see this line very crisp.
This area tends to be always like this, so relatively large open cells of defined by raised lines, and this scary could be very tightly knotted up with just sort of a jumble of hills and valleys forming just a rough surface.
In other times, it's like this.
Or is there, you know, kind of look about the same, but here we go.
So back to the case at point.
This one pretty easy to do because identify.
Here's this corona at the tip, so it's a track endrina.
And here is this nice mid abdomen must be.
Gonna read E Marie and if it was on a Willow like game over, you've got that.
But the problem is sometimes they're brown, so I'm gonna pull the specimen and actually let's go back and look at the characteristics here other than the red.
So we're looking at this, we're looking for.
The yellow highlighted and I would have highlighted it for not just if if it was always read then that's all you need to highlight this case.
Sometimes it's brown, so there's more to highlight to help separate it.
So clear story relations.
Umm, with only vague pits.
So that's different from most.
So most of them don't have striations on the section below the Esteli.
They have some kind of pitting pattern or even a glossy area fat to thin.
Not very differentiated.
OK.
So recall see Anotha greater than three times wider at the top than at the bottom.
Here it's only 1.25 to 1.75.
So, uh, really?
Not a whole lot.
Uh, it doesn't widen as it goes towards the apex of the head much at all.
So that's highlighted as a important feature and so border a proportial triangle it says present and clear.
I don't think I saw that in that red one very well, but perhaps we didn't have quite the angle on it.
We'll pull that back up.
It's still on there and then outside much finer than inside.
Again, I didn't really see that either.
And then the tergites in this case were orangish, but in other cases not.
It says oranges to dark brown so that the same and pitting on T1 moderate one to three and then again this note.
Here, Eastern individuals tend toward brown abdomens, so let's look at the.
Umm.
Specimen.
The red specimen again to see if the alignment of some of these things occurs in terms of.
Pitting and head patterns.
So we go back here, no.
To the phobia, let's look at that.
So what we're looking for is not a whole lot of difference in relative wits and pick this back down, bring the specimen into view.
I'm going to change the angle a little bit.
And so.
Panel.
So Fulvia are very nicely defined in this picture and you can see that this is not as wide as others.
In other words, it's not really mashing in against the lateral ocelli this line is hardly moving away from the edge of the eye at all, and this fovea is narrower.
But we saw a on the spreadsheet.
Now the difference was 1.25 to 1.75, so almost approaching to, but you can see that the the relative difference in the wits is not very great.
So that's a match.
Ohh here if we look up here again.
So what we're looking for here is.
An actual striations.
So and this is a good shot.
So you can see these this pattern, this linearity, this, you know, call it, striations, if you will, in the raised areas.
Let's see if I can get even further up there.
Not necessarily.
Great.
Uh, in this area.
So you can't really even see pits once you're seeing is a straight area, but as you've been looking as we've been talking, you know that is true.
If you were had a whole series of these and you had all the species and you were doing comparison, yes, that's great.
But if you just had one specimen, you might be, you know, trying to second guess yourself.
And that's why we did this particular approach on this with this spreadsheet, because it's so comparative in some ways, but anyway.
Straight area without any obvious.
Uh.
Pitting and then I believe we go next to the proposal triangle and look at some features there and we're gonna do this again, but without a nice, bright, shiny red abdomen.
We have this red abdomen.
It's really we don't need to go through very far, although it's always.
Good to do double checking on other characters too, but over time you know to me so many hours in a day.
All right.
So in the proposal triangle would go back here, see what it says.
So we took care of the facial fovea thing.
So it says border present and clear and outside much finer than inside.
Well, I guess that is read the the last few.
This is the same specimen.
It didn't seem to be that different and I still would argue that that outside isn't that much finer than the inside.
But if we look over in this direction, it seems to be.
More the case.
Again, look at these things under the microscope.
Can be misleading.
So you could see the point there so I can see the boundary.
This looks pretty similar out here, but it might again be easier to see if I was looking under the microscope.
OK, so already got jumped to.
Now a brown specimen from the region here.
Here and hello.
Do I have a brown specimen? Should.
You know, here's a brown specimen without a head.
Some reason?
Yeah.
What about this one?
Here's a brown specimen with the head.
Right.
So where did this come from?
Well, it has a question mark next to it as to to it's validity as Marie A.
But we now having looked at our red specimens.
And do an evaluation.
The Browns specimen and see if it gives us satisfaction.
What countries are pretty fun?
You know, in terms of like there are a whole series of characters, even if they're sort of blendy, and after some experiences, like, OK, I could see that.
So in this case, umm, it's a little bit the angle is a little bit odd.
This fovea is not showing up as brightly as this, but you can see that this distance and this distance aren't relatively close compared to some of those others, so we're gonna check that box now. Here.
This is where the area below the Acela should be striate.
Let's see.
And there should be very little, uh, pitting obvious.
Well, First off, I see pitting and so that doesn't really match.
This may be why this is a question mark specimen on that other one, it was like pretty clear there were no pits and you could really see.
I mean, if you crossed your eyes, you could perhaps see that there's some linearity, but the other one clearly had that.
This does not, so this decreases my belief in this one, but it was listed as a question mark.
French or good reason now going to with the prodigal triangle area?
We should see a sharp line, first of all, vibe wise, this proposal triangle vibes very differently than the other one and it is and the other one had that red abdomen, which is sort of a tell.
So here, look at how big and different those cells are versus the outside of the cells.
So we do have this clearly demarcated situation.
Here you can very nicely see the arena separates the dorsal surface from this vertical surface facing.
So here is the rest of the proposal triangle coming down, but this vertical Corina or this little Corina.
This raised line on the edge is so distinct in this one now, so this is very distinct and this is clearly a lot denser and finer, and it's granularity than this and this has has quite large bold things.
So it doesn't look like the other one in terms of it's not just like this is something painted brown, not red.
So it's good to leave it as a question mark.
Umm in this particular case, because it does look like something different and these are the kinds of things then everyone pulls their hair out over, but our cross our fingers, we hope to be doing more molecular things in the future.
Don't get in touch with us yet, but maybe maybe in the future will be asking you for your mystery stuff.
So we can, you know, continue.
Looking at these nuances, Ohh, doing runs of Bob many, many hopefully many many groups of species.
OK, So what time do we have, Claire, do we have time for another or not?

Maffei, Clare J 54:04
It is 158.

Droege, Sam 54:07
OK.
Well, let's go.
So we won't do another one, but let's go back to our spreadsheet and we will, you know, we got them.

Maffei, Clare J 54:18
Wanna try to figure out what that one actually is?

Droege, Sam 54:21
No, not not.
Ah, uh.
You know, I could, but it would be a whole lot of me talking to myself, looking at things we could do that at at the end to go back to that as a thing.
But you know, there are many, many things here to look at.
So I think I would rather, I think continue talking about each of these.
So we get a visual and get a a look feel for those and then we can go back and and do that one and see if we can come up with an answer.
But there's all these different columns to associate with and you know, think about it would be several a good several minutes to umm floss that one into submission and maybe we couldn't.
So that's the delightful part of doing bees.
Many, many times you can't be absolute about it.
Umm, so I think that a good place you see, even though we had covered the basics with forbesii, we did not even get halfway through the rest.
So, but we will, we'll we'll make it through.
This is why we do these classes.
Questions, comments.
Things you'd like to see done differently.
Any notions?

Maffei, Clare J 55:43
Nothing that chat unmute if you got it.

Droege, Sam 55:49
Gonna stop sharing.
So payments and stop sharing.
There we go.
Still.
Yeah.

Maffei, Clare J 56:09
Well, fantastic.
Very efficient.
Umm, I reached out to Robin Mike, so maybe they'll join us.
This will be a long series with Andrina, but if not, we'll pick up at Miranda.

Droege, Sam 56:27
Right.
And then one of these days Nomada and schottis.

Maffei, Clare J 56:33
We need to also go back and finish dialectics.
We gave Joel a break, but maybe those back.

Droege, Sam 56:39
Oh yeah.
Oh my gosh so much to do.
It's like there's hundreds of species or something.

Maffei, Clare J 56:46
Wild.
So weird.
All right, everybody.
Thank you.

Maffei, Clare J stopped transcription